44. Food Freedom / Lara Zibarras
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Dr Lara Zibarras is a psychologist and food freedom coach. She helps women develop a healthy and happy relationship with food, without guilt or emotional eating. Today's episode we talk all about food freedom, and what steps we can take to create a healthy mindset. We dive into topics: weight loss, intuitive eating, diet culture, core beliefs, common struggles, and Lara's personal journey with food. This topic is powerful and I can't wait for you to listen!
Lara’s program Health Mindset Matters: helps women discover the science and psychology behind why they've struggled with weight, binges and emotional eating. Women learn how to tune into their bodies and rediscover how to eat for both nourishment and enjoyment - creating a mindset for sustainable health.
Lara Zibarras
Thank you so much for having me, Katie. I'm so excited to be here.
Katie Kay
Yeah, it's so cool. How we connected and I just want to start with this just to kind of show the audience of how amazing you are as a person, I received an email from you. And it was just so kind and genuine. And you listed out some of the episodes you had listened to. And I just felt like that was such a profound like I, I just don't get that many emails that just are like so well written out. Like so genuine. So thoughtful, so mindful. And then at the end viewer talking about how you do coaching for food freedom and helping your clients build a healthier relationship with food. And you're like, do you think that would be something your listeners would be interested in? And like, there was no question I was like, this woman has to be on the podcast, she is amazing. And just so kind, and all your words that you wrote out, and I could tell like, from that place, just that spiritually aligned, I feel like some people, you know, we rush through the day, we like, type a really quick email. And I can just tell like you're a really mindful and thoughtful person. So there was no question in my mind that I would love to have you as a guest. And also, like, obviously, this is a huge topic. So I'm really excited to get into it and get all of your insight on intuitive eating, and how we can all develop a healthier and happier relationship with food.
Lara Zibarras
I think the kindest introduction I've ever heard.
Katie Kay
I had to start that way. Because you know, we don't like I mean, I think it's just like, we don't naturally do that. And I just really thought that was a a true character, Mark. So thank you for being amazing. And and you're in the United Kingdom, which is so exciting, because I haven't had anybody on the podcast across seas. So this is really like this is a whole new air for body breaking free. So that's really exciting as well. And yeah, so let's start with your story and just maybe starting with becoming a psychologist. And then what led you On the path to becoming a food freedom coach.
Lara Zibarras
Yeah, so my background and training is, as a psychologist, I spent the last 15 years working in psychology and I came to the area of food freedom, I guess, partly because of my own story and journey with food, which started off in not such a good place and has ended in a good place. But essentially, I started dieting back in my teens, I spent quite a lot of my teens late teens, early 20s, with a very negative relationship with food, very negative relationship with my body, and I was really trying to do everything I could to change my appearance. And for me, that led me down the path of dieting, which sadly then led me down disordered eating, and then eventually an eating disorder. So I was probably early 20s, where my relationship with food was such that I was either super restrictive and trying to cut as much food out of my diet as possible. But then that would never last long. And I would end up binging and then purging. So it took me a while to realize that actually, I was bulimic. And I think partly, you know, I was studying for a degree in psychology. So obviously, learning about these kinds of disordered eating behaviors and actually experiencing myself, I got to the stage out of my psychology degree with a science, you know, I really don't want to be in this stage, I really want to heal from it. And I went to go and see an eating disorder counselor, or a nutrition counselor, and actually found that super helpful. I, I actually had a few sessions, I wouldn't say that my recovery was overnight, but it was, I was at that stage where I really wanted to change. So I was, I wanted to do everything I could to heal. And then I had these few years of actually real food freedom until my early 30s, when I had children. And then again, I struggled with my body image, my relationship with my body. And obviously, anyone who's listening who's been pregnant, you'll appreciate this, how much your body changes, and I think, not so much whilst I was pregnant, but it was post pregnancy. And after I'd had my youngest, I was struggling with that whole bounce back back culture that we have that everyone kind of says, Oh, you can get your body back. And let's get you back to your pre pregnancy, weight and all that. And I think I was really impacted by that. But because I'd had an eating disorder in the past, I knew that I never wanted to diet. So I was like, I'm not going to diet again. But I wanted to do something to get my pre baby body back. And I was very much sucked into wellness culture. And when I looked back on it, I realized that actually, for me, it was a diet in disguise, it was just another way of attempting to lose weight. But for with different reasons, I was following lots of wellness influencers who were essentially telling tattle telling you anyone to cut food out of your diet, for the purposes of health. So I was slowly going down this path again, of very disordered eating. But in the moment, I didn't see it as disordered eating because I was very much sucked into this idea that I was doing it for health. And actually now looking back, when I look at that period of time, it's probably about three years, I would classify myself as Orthorexic. And at the same time, I was also training to be a health coach because I had, I was always really interested in eating and trying to eat quote, unquote, quote, healthy foods, I thought all I've got to do children at the time, I thought I, you know, I love my job as a psychologist, but I also wanted to do something as well. So I decided to train as a health coach. And I think that also perpetuated a little bit of that disordered eating, because what I was learning was very weight centric. So it was all about helping people get quote, unquote, healthy, but really what we were learning was, was really focused on you know, restriction restricting food for the purposes of health. And then what happened to me, I guess, it was almost like a series of light bulbs where I was starting to see quite disordered eating behavior and myself and also I only had very, very few health coach clients and time but in them where I was seeing people binging, but only on quote unquote, healthy foods. So people who would say I really wanted a brownie, but I knew I wasn't allowed a brownie. So I made myself some sweet potato brownies, and then people would say, you know, and I ended up eating the whole tray, but it's fine because they're, quote unquote, healthy and people Are you having like real, like cravings for certain foods or, and things I've certainly noticed that myself was that inability to actually start enjoying, like going out I was finding going out with friends really stressful because if there was food around, I never knew what to eat because I was so restrictive in my diet actually got to the point where it was so restrictive, even more restricted than it had been when I was dieting in my, my late teens, early 20s, there was very little that I could eat. And I think I had this sudden moment of realization, especially noticing how my kids were noticing how I was eating. And I thought I can't do this, I have to change. And again, with my health coaching, I'd actually also been introduced to the health every size, movement, and also intuitive eating, but only as one of many tools to use. And I just had this thought one day, I must go back and read those books. And I, as I was reading, the more I read, I was like, oh, gosh, what I'm learning and what I've been doing, I just need to change it. So I had a full one at actually took some time off coaching and I read groups read, like read everything I could get my hands on, and refocused my coaching to be all about food freedom coaching. So now my focus is about helping people create this healthy and happy relationship with food without any of that guilt, basically. So yeah, so that's a very long answer. To your question. I think there's always a journey, isn't there?
Katie Kay
Yeah, I absolutely loved it. I think there's so many things that you're saying is so profound. And first, I just think that the your honesty and just being really transparent and real and the wrongness of what it is to deal with our relationship with food, it should be really, we should really shine honest light on it. And I can tell from you talking, sharing your story that you've done a lot of introspection. So you've done a lot of the inner work to really see and be aware of your own journey and what you've gone through. And I can imagine that just helps your clients immensely. Because it kind of sounds like you've gone through the roller coaster of dieting culture, and then under dieting, and then you know, wanting to lose weight, I think that's a really interesting thing, too is, is when we're at a point of we want to change our body or, you know, it could be weight loss, it could just be wanting to eat healthier. It's a very fine line between diet culture, and what are we doing to really serve ourselves and honor our body? And yeah, I guess like, I'm kind of curious, maybe we can dive into that a little bit more. Because me personally, I feel like I've been on that kind of spectrum. Like I've kind of been in that weird gray area where I know, first of all that diet culture, like I've been through that, so it's really harmful. And I know, I've been really unhappy. And I've been a lot smaller, I've been a lot skinnier and probably looked a lot, you know, more ideal in the standards of society. And I was also really miserable. So I know, like that kind of side of it. Like the diet culture is not serving me. But I also just really want to be at the weight that makes me feel good. And I want to feel athletic. So like mountain biking, skiing, and that has, you know, like I don't want to shy away from the fact that that has a lot to do with my weight. Yeah, and I think it's just like, so. And I'm sure there's some listeners as well. That's kind of wondering like, what is kind of that fine line where we can find a balance between feeling good and our bodies feeling athletic, or whatever weight we are, and maybe even wanting to lose weight and that but also not really getting sucked into that old mindset, that diet culture getting back, you know, thrown back into the mess. Yeah.
Lara Zibarras
I love that you've been brought that up, Casey because I think it is something that probably everyone struggles with when they get to that stage where you think I don't want to die again, but I want to change something needs to change. And so often I think this is where I went down is that that wellness that focus on wellness became wellness with a huge obsession which ended up impacting my mental health. So it's like how do you balance how do you have that balance where you are eating well, and exercising well but it doesn't become focused on diet you know, in diet culture. So I would say one big thing, and I do this a lot with my clients is actually to put weight loss on the back burner. So I totally understand why people want to lose weight. Because it's what doctor tells us, there's so much out there that perpetuates this idea that in order to be healthy, or in order to find love in order to, you know, be a better person, you need to lose weight. So with my clients, I say, let's put it on the back burner for now, let's kind of you know, we're not going to ignore it completely, but we're just going to put it over there. And let's instead focus on behaviors that you can implement in your life that are health promoting behaviors. And if we look at a lot of the research, there are behaviors that we can do that actually do impact our long term health outcomes. And there are things that a lot of people forget about. So one thing is sleep, if we get a good night's sleep, and I know sometimes when I speak to moms, they're like, Oh, don't talk to me about sleep. Because I understand I've been there, my daughter was a terrible sleeper. But getting enough sleep, giving ourselves the opportunity to have enough sleep. And that means, you know, seven plus hours a night, then there's amazing how many people sleep a lot less than that, that impacts everything, it impacts just our mood, it also impacts what kinds of cravings we have, are more likely to crave sweet things, if we haven't had enough sleep. We can also focus on things like having movement in our lives. So you know, not necessarily about hitting doing hardcore, high intensity exercise, but you know, just getting movement, whether that's walking around the block or getting into nature, you know, getting into nature is a good thing that can help us and it's about thinking about what we can do in terms of health promoting behaviors that think about that focus on everything. That's not just about weight and aesthetics. So do you like going to yoga or pilates because it helps your mental health or maybe it improves your strength, like you were saying, like feeling athletic strength, flexibility, stamina, maybe you want to start jogging, maybe you don't jog now, and you want to start jogging, learn to jog five miles because you want to increase that stamina. So what I try and help my clients do is focus on having other focuses that aren't to do with weight loss. And yes, over time, that might change your appearance. So if you start jogging, that might mean that you're you get stronger legs. But if you're doing it with a purpose of thinking about your long term health, as opposed to changing yourself aesthetically, or focusing on whether you're going to lose two pounds every week is actually so much better for you, and has a much more positive impact on your mental health as well. Because I think that's what sometimes people forget, when they're thinking about health, there's that health is not just about it's not just about what you eat, and how much exercise you do is about something far broader than that. So yeah, so it's about putting weight loss on the back burner and thinking about other health promoting behaviors instead. And I think one thing that we talked about the client struggles, but one thing that I know that some of my clients have struggled with is this idea that doing that focusing on health promoting behaviors might mean that you do end up losing weight. But it also might mean that you don't, you might stay the same or you might actually get heavier. So what we want to do is separate weight loss as being that end goal and focus much more on health promoting behaviors that actually will improve your health in the long term.
Katie Kay
Yeah, perfect. So I have I'm just going to interject some of my personal story, and hopefully that'll help, like broaden this whole concept. And maybe some listeners can relate. So putting the weight loss on the backburner. I do think that's really important. And I love how you're talking about you don't have to change like what you want, but just putting it off to the side. And I did that and I did that with the mindset of I still wanted to lose weight, but I also wasn't willing to go down this path any longer with just struggling so much with food every day it was just wearing on me like the mental and the mental energy of it is was just too overwhelming. So yeah, so I committed to this intuitive eating and one of the aspects and intuitive eating is going into it without any kind of weight loss goal because that is going to fully affect your ability to create a healthy relationship with food. And so I did that, we put it on the back burner. And, and when you're talking about doing, you know, different things and, and more listening to your body and less of, I need to do this or I should do this activity, I would almost go even further to say that it really doesn't, for me, at least my experience really didn't have anything to do with what I was doing. And I, but the more that I transformed my internal condition, it reflected back into how I was treating my body. And, and so the mindset aspect of it was just, it was so profound, and powerful, and really translated into my external life and what I was actually doing or performing, but really allowed me to connect to my body and a whole different way and, and some of those shoulds and needs need to and I need to go to yoga class or I should be doing this. Some of that just melted away, and just like allowed me to drop my shoulders and relax a little bit. And, and it and yeah, it's just, it's so I want to make that point. Because I think that at any point that you are committing to a new way of being, and really showing up for yourself in that way. And sometimes it even like that's all it really takes is just a willingness to want to change. And maybe not necessarily doing anything or controlling anything. But you know, focusing on your internal mindset and almost leading your life through affirmations and mantras and things that you're not even, like your mindset is not believing or used to or trusting yet. But just the willingness to look at those things and be like, Man, I'm trying to hold a friend path here. And it's scary and uncomfortable. And I'm like, I'm not even sure what I want. I just No, I don't want this path anymore. I think that for me, like that was the biggest thing. And, and so I guess I know that you are really big on mindset. And that's a huge thing in your coaching process. So do you have any remarks on my own experience? Or do you want to just kind of dive into some of that mindset stuff that you coach for your clients to help them?
Lara Zibarras
I love what you brought up there, Katie, because you've talked about that idea of you know, we can't change because what the reason why a lot of people want to change is because they're feeling unhappy about themselves. And often they'll have these thoughts and mindset and things that they say to themselves about how awful they are like the look at themselves in the mirror, oh, I look so terrible. You're so worthless, can't believe you could do this, by the way. So we have this like really negative self talk going on in our bodies. And I think a lot of that transition, as you've talked about, is thinking about, I really don't think that people can change when they're hating on themselves. I really don't. And whilst a lot of people say, and my clients have said to me, but I don't love myself, and I'm like, you don't need to love yourself to start to change, you've just got to change the way you're talking to yourself. So if that self talk is constantly negative, that constant chatter going on in your brain, and you can just stop saying that to yourself, or change it. So that rather than saying, you know, I'm so worthless, or I can never get anything, right? Just change it a little bit. So that that affirmation is more like, Well, each day, I'm learning to improve things. So you don't need to say like, I'm amazing. I'm wonderful, because I think a lot of people find that very hard with affirmations. I can't say that to myself, because I'm nowhere near that will How about talking about the process? So a lot of that mindset work is to do with self talk. And to really understand, is your mindset working for you or against you? So that's one element that coaching and another element is really thinking about whether you are in that dieting mindset and a lot of people are without really knowing that they are. So diet culture tells us that our relationship with food we need to restrict, we need to control we need to To cut out, so cut out certain foods, certain food groups cut out the amount that we're eating. It also tells us that food is inherently good or bad. So the way food is labeled, there's bad good treats cheat, healthy, unhealthy. So we're putting food into this sort of hierarchy. And I think also with diet culture, that relationship around exercise is very disordered. Because you think about I need to do exercise in order to burn calories. If I haven't done my one hour jog then and got really sweaty, then it doesn't really count. So we have this very disordered relationship with food and exercise within diet culture. So a lot of people just because of growing up in diet culture have this diet mindset, which a lot of people don't realize until it's pointed out to them. So what what a lot of the work I do is helping people to transition from a diet mindset to I call it a health mindset. But really, it's a health focus mindset, where people are thinking about what I was talking about earlier, in terms of those health promoting behaviors. So with food, it's completely different. When there's no restriction food, all foods fit, or food is just food. So we're taking away the labels. And we're saying, well, food is just food. And actually food can be great for other things, apart from just fuel. So it's about comfort, it's about connection, it's about nostalgia, it's about a lot of other things that we get, you know, some of it can be nourishing to our bodies, but some of it is nourishing to our soul, for example. And then also thinking about movement. And I like the word movement rather than exercise, that actually, if you're just getting up and moving your body every day, that's great. And whether that is just a walk around the block, or just, you know, cleaning, cleaning the house or doing some gardening or just getting outside and you know, walking around a tree or something, all that counts as stuff that's good for your body, and quite possibly good for your soul as well. So it's about a shifting that mindset around what you're doing the eating and the movement and how you think about those things. So, and for some people, it can be a really quick process, they suddenly noticed how entrenched they are in diet mindset, and they go, I'm going to switch my thoughts. And tomorrow, I'm gonna think about food and movement in a very different way. But for other people, it can be quite hard. And there are certain things that take longer to move, and you need those constant reminders, affirmations like we were talking about earlier to help you move through and, you know, go through that journey. Really.
Katie Kay
Yeah, I I really love how you're explaining diet culture, and that there are these labels and good and bad and like this food, police, this whole kind of whole thing that we don't actually understand or maybe not understand, but we aren't actually aware of until we are right until we shine a light on those things. And for me, that was one of the biggest things is just understanding that the right and wrong labels that I have put on food and lots of other things in my life are up for discussion. Like they're, I can look at them and and decide like, okay, maybe this isn't right, according to somebody else. But for me, it's you know, it feels really good and, and kind of leading that, like what feels good for me in this moment. And so it did kind of shock my system in that way of reframing the right and wrong good or bad and really opened up some more freedom for me just to to look at food differently and and I even like allowed myself to eat the bad like quote unquote bad foods ice cream Oreos, like all the things I love. And I notice what what I when I ate it what that felt like in my body and I was more conscious. And it's really scary I think to be in that place of allowing yourself to let go of some of that control. And especially when you know scientifically ice cream, a pint of ice cream is not not good according to the rules because the sugar and all the calories and blah blah blah. But that was it. Really, I mean, that was a really scary thing for me to just allow myself to do that. And it did take a lot of mindset work, because I could see my old mindset creeping in, like, you shouldn't be doing this, this was really bad. And then especially after I ate the ice cream, the guilt, like, oh, my gosh, what are you going to do tomorrow to burn these calories and, and the, if I didn't have that mental awareness, then I would have fallen right back into my old patterns. But I had, you know, I had that awareness now, which was the only thing that I needed to guide me in that process and really trust that I was connecting to that place of love within me. And so the more that I could just see those thoughts and be like, Hey, okay, like, I see that guilt, like, I know what's going on here. But you know, you guys, were just doing something new. I'm packing all my parts now. But we're, you know, we're just doing something new, we're just gonna try this out, see how it feels in our body. And I just think that commitment for me of just knowing that I didn't want my life to be controlled by food anymore. And that was really a big thing for me, like, I just really couldn't, I knew that my purpose was so much more, I knew my energy expanded way more than this small container I was putting it in. And the amount of I already said this, the amount of mental energy I was spending on food on my body on how I was looking on the weight. I just couldn't, you know, I just knew that it was I was living a really small life. And so yeah, I just think it was it was a really scary and vulnerable place to be in to change. But I do think that that mindset of really, building a foundation of awareness can be like such a profound thing. And I'm so glad that you focus your coaching on that. Do you have any comments? I know, I'm just kind of sharing my story. But I think that there's just so much truth and honesty, when we talk about like food, like, it's just silly, like a cup of ice cream, like can bring up so much so much uncomfortableness. But I think that we all can relate to it, because we're all we're all in that cultural matrix of standards and right and wrong. So yeah, do you have any, any comments on that?
Lara Zibarras
One thing I would love to comment on is your point about how much of your life felt like it was consumed and your energy and I just think for anyone listening who has ever had any kind of disordered relationship with food is is thinking about the time you spend on it time you spent tracking calories, tracking macros, reading labels, worrying about sugar, the energy, your how much of your happiness and well being is tied up. And I actually don't weigh myself now. But I remember very clearly like how stepping on the scales for me would completely ruin my day, or make me feel kind of really happy about my day. And this moment in time stepping on scales would have the would impact my day so strongly. And you just think how much time and energy and effort and money that women especially women spend on trying to change their bodies to attain that a thin ideal, that ideal that is perpetuated by diet culture that really, actually probably only about 5% of the population could actually attain because of their genetics and their their makeup. So we're constantly trying to achieve something that's totally impossible. And then people tried diets in order to do that. And then diets are basically set up to fail. So people then feel even more worthless and even more unworthy, and even more like failures because they keep failing over and over again. And that mindset that you've talked about, it can either be that spiraling negative mindset that takes you on a downward spiral. But I think once you identify that that's what you've been part of in diet culture. And I was I was right their way in they're very deep entrenched in diet culture and then later entrenched in wellness culture. Once you identify that and you can start using your mindset for the positive, then you can start having this positive virtuous cycle that takes you up and out and beyond.
Katie Kay
Yeah, I 100% felt like felt like a failure. And I can see that now that the pressure that I was placing on myself to be really healthy and to perform at a level where I knew I was losing weight, and all of those things, it just perpetuated the feeling of feeling not good enough. And I already had that deep core belief in me, and who knows where that came from. But I think a lot of us struggle with that core belief of not feeling good enough. And, yeah, the pressure of trying to perform with my food and movement, it just, it was like kind of this never ending cycle. And so now I can really see it, because the thing that actually needed to get healed was that feeling of not good enough. And I was trying to fix it from external things. But the amazing miracle of the part that I could actually see, now some of those deeper fears that they're actually now take, I'm getting out of that headlock, and they're not leading my life anymore. Which is it, I say, a miracle, because it is a miracle to be able to see those things. And I do feel like a lot of us are living a lot smaller, and not living in our purpose and truth like we could be, and shining that light out into the world like we could be, because we're getting controlled by these fears. I mean, if you just imagine a day in the life of Katie, five years ago, of like, I'm not good, these constant thoughts, I'm not good enough, I'm not doing enough. I'm unsupported. I'm helpless in this situation, there's nothing I can do about this. And that just over and over again, building up those insecurities. I mean, it's just, it doesn't matter what weight I was at, I was living in that place of fear. And I just think like so many of us, I mean, the amazing thing is, is that if you are struggling with your relationship to food, that's actually such an amazing thing to be able to look at, because that is showing you that's almost an opportunity to understand, like, what is really going on here? And how am I holding myself back? And what kind of fears are actually a lot deeper. And so this actually leads me this is perfect, because this is leading me right into the next question of the core beliefs that we hold. And you talked a lot about that. And then your first email you sent to me, you were talking about some of these core beliefs around food, weight and body image. So how does that impact our journey with food?
Lara Zibarras
Hmm, you're such a good question, actually. Because core beliefs are essentially general principles and assumptions that guide you through life. And they can either be positive things, or self limiting, they totally sent shape our sense of self worth, like you were just talking about. And that also impacts the decisions we make. So if we are trying to heal our relationship with food, they're really an important part of the journey. Now, the thing is called beliefs start very young so often, it's at an age where we're feeling very well, we are very impressionable. So things that our parents say, or teachers, any other caregivers, or like brothers and sisters say to us, those are that they stick. And we interpret them as truth, even if rationally, they aren't truth at all. So I think core beliefs are so important when we're navigating diet culture, because just like you say, if you've got a core belief that speaks to a sense of unworthiness on I'm unlovable. And then when diet culture is saying, You need to change yourself in order to be more loved or in order to be more worthy, then you're more likely to get sucked into that toxic diet culture because you think that the answer is to change how you look. So I honestly think most people who have dieted or been on healthy eating plans or try to change their appearance in some way. It speaks to something going on in their core beliefs. So I always say when I work through this with my clients that it can be really uncomfortable and can take a lot of work. And for some people, it does need quite a big mindset shift. But just like I was saying earlier for some people when they change And when they uncover and then challenge their core belief, it's like it can be a switch because you learnt your core belief. You can unlearn it. And for some people, it's like, Oh, my goodness, oh, that's how I think, right? I'm, you know, I'm going to change and other people, it takes years and like you said, the word healing, it takes some years of healing. But it is totally possible. And I would say there are, there are loads of core beliefs that come up a lot in in my coaching, but I think one of the really key ones is this whole idea that thin is better. So if we think about that, it's such a classic one. But I really encourage clients to think about some of the messages that they've received, growing up. So it could be about their own appearance, their body, their weight, it could have been that someone commented on their weight, maybe they were weighed at school, maybe they got teased by someone for something to do with their appearance. But I think it's also really important to explore things that weren't said out loud, because you could have very supportive and lovely parents and they never said anything negative to you about your body or anything. But you constantly saw your mum on a diet and you're so you saw your you heard your mom say things like, Oh, I can't go swimming because I can't be seen in a bikini or I'm, you know, I need to lose X amount of pounds before that big event. So you see six year old you sees who used to save your beautiful mother dieting, you think, Well, if she's not, I think she's perfect. But if she doesn't think that she's perfect, then that means I'm not perfect. And then maybe thin is better, because she's always dieting. So it's what we take on consciously, subconsciously, explicitly, implicitly. So we have this pressure to look a certain way. So a lot of what I do with clients is helping people really challenge and question that core beliefs if it is then really better. And actually, we know in a lot of the research that then doesn't equate to healthy and like Freesat I think we were both probably more unhealthy, I know that I was definitely more unhealthy when I was thinner. And if you take, if you view healthy, holistically, you know, think about the mental health and all that kind of thing. And there's a lot of research out there that proves that that thin doesn't equal healthy. So first of all, challenging that core belief, but then what I work with my clients is helping them put together positive affirmations that they can use, that challenges that core belief to create a new core beliefs around that area. So one of the one of the affirmations that we use a lot, and I use this with my daughter a lot is that all bodies are worthy, regardless of their weight and size. And I think that's a much better kind of idea to have a core belief to have them that core belief around thin is better.
Katie Kay
Oh, I love that affirmation. I'm writing down the time right now. So I can put it in the show notes. I love that. And I Yeah, it's crazy. I almost am like, I hesitate to say like how much affirmations really changed my life? Because I think like sometimes we see those as a little silly or maybe a little over positive like those, you know, you imagine this like super positive person and you're like, oh my gosh, like, I love my body. I love food, you know. But yeah, you're right. affirmations, like, are so amazing, because we do hold on to a lot of core beliefs. And we don't necessarily want to be holding on to some of these core beliefs. And one that I really loved was my body's differences are its strengths. And I, I held on to that one because I think that I've always wanted to just feel unique, and just follow a unique path. That is for me, and then I kind of woke up to the fact like, well, if I want to be unique, I'm trying to find my purpose in this world. And yet, I'm trying to fit the standards of being the exact same as everybody else. Like that is so silly. That is so silly. And so some of those affirmations help me just to realize that, yeah, I can look different and be happy with exactly how I am. And maybe not even exactly as I am but at least aware of where I am and moving forward from that place. Yeah, and that was a big one for me too is there is no perfect place that I'm trying to get to and there will always be times where I feel uncomfortable. And there won't always be sunshine and rainbows and happy positive attitude. But the way that I approach that is with much more compassion and respect. And just being curious. I think that's one thing is just being that observer and noticing, when I do feel crummy in that moment. And maybe there's some thoughts of guilt coming up. Like the next day after I ate something that I, my old mindset was saying, I shouldn't have a too much. And the power of just bringing awareness to that thought, and then noticing how I felt in my body. And just notice that sensations. And Pema children talks a lot about this, it's really interesting in a way that if you shine a light and bring awareness with compassion and non judgment, that it fades away, that it releases, and you can let go of that fear and just exist exactly as you are in that moment. But yeah, I could obviously talk about all of the mindfulness stuff, because I just love that stuff. But there's, yeah, there's just so many things that you were talking about with those core beliefs. And there's just so many of them. And that one of thin is better, is just something that we're constantly being real that social media, and it's a really good one to notice. And just be mindful of when I lost weight. So I went to nutritionist, Becky cannon, I also had her on the podcast, and we went through the diet, I tracked the calories, when I lost the weight that may got to my ideal weight, I had a goal. And the really odd thing was I wasn't any happier. Sure, I felt better on my mountain bike, I did notice that I was really in shape. But it also was really interesting, because I told Becky that I was like, I don't even know if I really like being like this in shape on my mountain bike, because I can't like I feel like I'm always having to do more than, like, I'll go for an hour ride with my girlfriends. And then I was like, Oh my gosh, I need to go for another hour. Because I didn't get the exercise I needed. I was like, you know, I kind of want to go back to that wave a little bit and be like a little not as athletic. Because after an hour bike ride, I felt really good. So it's all like, you know, it's all perspective. And I think the more that we can just, like bring in that perspective and be like, Oh, that's kind of a silly thought. But that actually feels really good for me and my body. Yeah, it's just kind of a roller coaster. And I could obviously I could just talk about, like all about the awareness part, because I just think that's the most powerful tool in the toolbox. But I do want to go into some specific tools that you would recommend, especially to somebody starting out on their food freedom journey. And then the other question I'm just going to tie this in, is can you explain or define what is food freedom?
Lara Zibarras
Yeah, so food freedom really is about I think, as a first step is ditching diet culture and the restrictions that diet culture suggests that we should eat with so I think if you look at what diet culture says, it's either talking about restricting the amount of food you have, or restricting certain food groups or certain types of food. So we're moving away from that food freedom to food freedom, where you are giving yourself permission to enjoy all foods. And I think I love the phrase that I hear quite a lot of dietitians who work in the space called there's this idea of all foods fit. And I think that's so true with food freedom is that all foods fit in your week, unless of course you have a medical reason to give something up. If you're celiac, don't eat gluten, but most people don't have good reason to cut food out of their diet. So we're thinking about all foods fitting. And we're thinking we're taking a much more wide perspective on food, which I did mention earlier, but thinking about food being more than just fuel we eat for satisfaction and enjoyment not just to fuel our bodies. And then the other thing that I think is really important, and actually I would say that this would be one of my kind of wellness tips for people is to take labels away from foods so don't label foods good or bad or whatever. I would really encourage people to think about How they're talking about food. And, you know, if you're even if you're used using, you know, like talking about Guilty Pleasures or cheats and treats, you're putting some sort of moral value on food, so therefore, you're eating, you're being good, or you're being bad when you eat food. So that would be one of my wellness tips is to take the labels away. And that's all part of food freedom is learning to neutralize food and think of food is just food. So a big tip is to just say it's an apple, or it's a chocolate bar, or it's breakfast, lunch, dinner, dessert, elevenses, whatever, whatever you want to say, but just don't use any morals when you're describing food. And then food freedom is also about being able to eat without guilt. So you've talked about guilt a few times, and I think that's a big thing for people moving away from diet culture is that guilts such a huge part of what diet culture sells us. Whereas actually, we can eat without guilt. If we want to eat a doughnut for breakfast, then go ahead and do it. But I really encourage people to connect with that eating experience. So also, food freedom is about learning how to go inward. So what a lot of what a lot of diet culture tells us is that you won't be able to eat healthy unless you're following a healthy eating plan, or you're following this plan, you're counting your macros. But actually what we learn with food freedom, is how to connect in words and listen to our bodies, cues. So we for most people, it's relearning what your hunger feels like and what your fill fullness feels like, because we've spent so many years ignoring it. And it was a big learning process for me personally, because especially in that first phase where I was either restricting or binging and purging. So I'd actually really lost connection with my own internal hunger and fullness cues. So a lot of food freedom is about reconnecting with that experience, and reconnecting with eating experience, I do do a tiny bit of mindful eating as well so that people can actually and I don't think mindful eating is, is useful in every setting, especially if you're a mom, and I can't mindfully eat in all settings. But I think doing it as an exercise a few times is such a nice way to reconnect with eating and reconnecting with the idea of food being about taste and texture and temperature, there's so much more to food. And then the final thing with food freedom, I'd say that a lot of it is about using your mindset and habits. We've talked a lot about mindset that to support this in the long term. So helping people shift their focus, shift their mindset, and use habits to have those long term and sustainable habits that are going to help you feel better in the long run.
Katie Kay
Yeah, those are some great tools. Thank you for sharing. I think there's just so much that we there's so many different tools and different, like little helpful things that we can all learn. And we can all build a healthier relationship with food. And I think food freedom, like I'm still on my journey to really find full freedom. And I'm not even sure that might be even, like there's no place just like there's no perfect place. But yeah, I think like for me, realizing that I couldn't really be mindful with my food and I couldn't really feel very connected to it at the beginning. Because I had a lot of resistance I had to work through first to clear this space. And journaling really helped me do that just to notice what I was feeling what thoughts were coming up and kind of understand some of those deeper fears. Obviously therapy really helped me understand some of those deeper fears. But yeah, I feel like now it's really it is I think we all kind of have to pause and really realize how far you can come by doing the work because I just feel even though I'm still on my journey, I think it's just incredible and the way I can feel so loving towards myself and food and and the food that I eat now. I honestly don't think too much about it, which is probably a really good sign. And I really notice when I start falling back into my old patterns. And especially craving sugar at night is, is not a bad thing. Because sometimes I do emotionally and totally respect it because I need that emotional release. And yes, I'm using food, to work through it. And sometimes that is just the best thing that feels best for me. But I can notice sometimes when I'm having those emotional cravings, that it's, it's a good sign for me to realize that something off is and is off internally. And yeah, I think that like, it's just so cool. In the whole process of becoming more intuitive with your body and listening to its signals and honoring its signals. It's just a really amazing process. And it really is exciting, I think. And in that there is this different path we can all take that is so full of love and compassion. And there's just nothing better than taking one step forward on that path. And over and over again, feeling that alignment and building that connection and getting to a place where you feel really mindful and connected with food. I know it's paid off and my life tenfold. And if releasing that amount of stress and worry around my food, all of that energy is now put into how I can show up in the best way and the podcast and getting out of my own way and my own insecurities and show up in you know, service. And that's really what I think is just the best, like the like most fulfilling, you know, fills my heart so much every day. So yeah, I think like, I just wanted to kind of spread that message of love to the listeners, because there really is light and and being on that path is light in itself. And so I want you to Laura, just to go through some of the programs that you offer. And if somebody is, you know, what you're saying is resonating with them that they can go look at what you're doing and check out all of the amazing coaching that you have online.
Lara Zibarras
Thank you. Yeah, so my main coaching program that I offer is called Health mindset matters. And it's an online course essentially, which goes through four phases. So the first is helping people to ditch diet culture. The second is about helping people to tune back into their bodies so they can reconnect with that hunger and fullness. The third is based on the principles of intuitive eating. So it's helping people learn how to eat again for both nourishment and enjoyment. And then the final one is really bringing it all together and using mindset and habits to make sure that everything that people learn is long term and sustainable so that they, you know, just like you've been talking about so they have those tools when to know what to do. If they ever feel like they're kind of falling off that process. Yeah, and I can say a little bit more about if people are interested in finding out a bit more about my approach. I have a free masterclass which people can find on my website website, which is Dr. Laura zed.com. And the masterclass classes at forward slash masterclass.
Katie Kay
Awesome, awesome. I will definitely put all of that in the show notes so everybody can check it out. And then lastly, Laura, can you share your own wellness, I love to ask the guests at the end just their own wellness routine? And what are some of those things that you have in your daily practice that you rely on and you love and you can share with us to give us inspiration?
Lara Zibarras
So I love when you asked me this question that that it was about daily practice. And I was like, do I do anything, always daily? And I don't think I do but there are certain things that I do very regularly in my week that I have come to rely on. So one is meditation. So I have a meditation practice, which is not quite daily because sometimes it doesn't happen on the weekends. But it's definitely daily when I'm you know, up and about and you know, work days. So meditation, I love reading I find reading like a real kind of lovely mind release which is great. And then the other thing which in the last couple of years, I have really prioritize because I feel like it takes all the movement boxes for me is reformer Pilates, which I do maybe two or three times a week and I love it because it, it speaks to my kind of the strength and flight flexibility elements and makes me and I feel, I think there's my mindset element and it just makes me feel really good. And I so I love it. So those I would say, oh, and the other thing, which I don't do enough, is getting into nature, that's another thing that just makes my mind feel very at peace.
Katie Kay
Perfect, I love it. Thank you so much for sharing. And I'm just gonna end with a quote, well, actually, I pulled a mantra card for our discussion today. And I want to read it, because I think it's really amazing. So it says, I am willing to see my sameness with others, this opens my awareness to oneness. And I just love that. So, so much. And I think especially coming to our discussion with food, we all experience a lot of the sameness. And you are always here you are always supported in and I'm talking to the listeners there, you know, always have our support, and, and it's okay to be in the struggle, and we all struggle. And I think the more that we can see that oneness and that shared collectiveness, and, you know, it is like not shying away from some of these topics. It's a big deal, like we're eating every day like food is in our lives every single day. And I just think that Laura, having you here is so profound, and just being able to open up and be honest and, and share your amazing work. I just I'm so grateful for everything that you're doing. And just telling the listeners that that we are here for them. And obviously you are here you have all your online stuff. So if anything that Laura's saying that is resonating with you, and you want to reach out to her and check out her programs, and also feel free, I'll put both of our Instagram contact. And if there's anything that you want to share ever, you know, DMS message us send us a comment. The more I think that we just kind of open up to some of those maybe insecurities. And sometimes it can be embarrassing to share a relationship to food. But I think like you have a support team, for sure you have a support team here. And so if there's anything that we can do to help, and then if there any last messages, Laura that you want to share to the listeners? And if not, that's perfect as well.
Lara Zibarras
I think the final thing I would say is that food freedom is available to everyone. So I think sometimes when people start on this path, they think well, there's no way I could ever be able to keep ice cream or cookies or chocolate in my house because I will just go crazy about it. And I just eat it straight away. I thought that I would never be able to be relaxed around food and have ice cream in my freezer. And now I have everything in the house. And occasionally I eat it. And most often I don't because it's not that exciting to me anymore, because it's there. So if anyone is listening and wondering if they'll ever get to that stage, and I just want to say that it's totally possible for everyone. I love
Katie Kay
it and do with optimism. Love, love, love it. Okay. Well, thank you so much for being here all the way in the UK. Amazing. And thank you all listeners. Thank you for being here. spending your time with us. I know your time is precious. So thank you sending so much love to everyone. I will see you all next week.
