19. Jennifer Lowe-Anker
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Jennifer Lowe-Anker, artist and author of the book "Forget Me Not", shares her story and insights on the podcast today. In the episode, we explore the relationship we have with the environment around us, and the environment we have with our own body. We dive into Jennifer’s story of losing her husband Alex Lowe, and out of grief and loss, found love with Conrad Anker. We talk about Jennifer’s story, her book, and the beautiful insights she has into nature, life, and connection. Jennifer offers us such an amazing gift of perspective, and what’s truly important when it comes to the precious moments of this life.
"The in-between parts, is the part we have that we can do something with. And if we're brave enough and courageous enough to love someone, and to forgive them for all of their imperfections, and be open hearted to their love for us, then, we can live life with a lot of joy" ~Jennifer Lowe-Anker
Katie Kay: To start, can you tell us a little bit about your background?
Jenni: Well, I was born in Montana. And so I think that had a big part in the person that I became, because I am 66 years old. And so when I was born into the state in 1955, it was a bit smaller than it is now, the population was a lot less. And so Missoula was my home. My father was a third generation montanan. And so my great grandparents came and settled here in the 1870s on my dad's side. And so some family history here, which I really was enamored with, and kind of fell in love with, with the state and the outdoors from the time I was a little kid. And so just knowing that my great grandparents had come here and kind of faced, what was then kind of a wilderness and a lot of unknown, and homesteaded and started life with with a family here was always inspiring for me. And so I think I had three sisters, and all of us were taken into the outdoors, we played outside all the time, we had a nice kind of a middle class home in a nice neighborhood where we could walk to school, and a nice big backyard, with raspberries all along the back fence and Rosa flowers that my mom planted. And a great big swing set. So from from my earliest memories as being a kid in Montana, it was running out the back door to play and with my sisters and and then my dad had a love of horses. So I was pulled into that world pretty young to started writing at a very young age, maybe four or five. And then as I got older, I just really fell in love with it. And my dad gave me a horse which I rode through my teenage years and, and that was a big part of I think, my living in the outdoor world and feeling empowered by the relationship with the horse, but also the physical activity of riding. And, and then we skied. My dad introduced us to ski and got us all skis when we were in grade school. And Carter does up he didn't ski himself, but he thought it was a pretty cool thing to do and wanted us to have that opportunity. And so we started skiing when I was about in fourth grade, I guess and I fell in love with that. So that was another outlet into physicality in the outdoors. Yeah. And so that's early life. And it's pretty sweet, really. I feel pretty entitled that I was able to grow up in this beautiful wild place and to connect with nature. And Montana is one of the few states in the union that has a vast diversity of wildlife, including predators. And so by the time I was maybe 17, I really identified with nature and fell felt that in a way, being human was? Well, you know, what I still feel today is that humanity, you know, that we have kind of taken over the planet, and that we don't give enough respect to the other forms of life on the planet. So, you know, I felt that, in a way. It was it was a bit of a negative thing, you know, realizing, Oh, my gosh, I'm part of this species. And, you know, we're not doing a great job here. So I guess I endeavored early on to be an advocate for the environment.
Katie Kay 10:52
Wow, that's amazing. And I can relate to growing up in nature. And I grew up in Boise, Idaho. Yeah, big city. Oh, but my parents would take us to McCall every weekend and the summer. And then we had a cabin, more northern Idaho and the gospel wilderness area. Beautiful. Beautiful. And when we were up there, it was my favorite memories growing up in my childhood. And when you're that remote, which Montana very similar, yeah. Even the big cities were very remote. Yeah, then and it's, yeah, it's like this different connection that you get to this wild environment that it's interesting that you say, it was almost a negative perspective, when you start to think about the impact that we have on this beautiful place. It is. Yeah, because it got ahead. Sorry.
Jenni 11:54
No, I agree with you. I mean, it's it's a it's an introspective, you know, guilt. Yeah, that that I really felt, you know, by the time I was maybe 17. So, you know, it's like, oh, my gosh, I'm one of these creatures that's doing a lot of harm. In the world. Yeah. And so, anyway, um, back then, when I was in high school, there were a bunch of us kids, and we had, we had a little group that we formed, there were a few other leaders in the group who were kind of stellar leaders, in my opinion, and, and went on to live their life, you know, kind of giving to the earth in different ways. But you know, they started a little environmental group, students for aware society hero to sort of talk about recycling, and, you know, thinking about our impact. And, you know, we really, I think, truly thought, well, oh, you know, in the next decade or two, you know, we're gonna be the leaders in society, or, you know, everyone will think like this and realize that we need to do something, you know, to stop the growth of humanity and to stop our footprint. But it didn't happen that way. So it's, I think, right now, probably the biggest challenge for all of us as humans is is climate change, and looking forward and trying to find hope, in you know, what is the survival of our species going forward? And how is that going to look? And how are we going to be a part of positive change to to make it possible for people to live the life that I felt so lucky to get to have?
Katie Kay 13:59
Yeah, and you're most most people what's normal is not has not been normal for you. Because you have been so ingrained and nature and Montana and and what you've said, is you identified with nature, so for you, that was part of your soul that was part of your beam. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. And that's so I mean, even for me, like you are probably on the other end of the scale, most people born in the city being around people. And so when I, when I was hearing you talk, it's and then having that sense of self and identity with nature, is really fascinating. And you were talking about these words of being aware and having that connection, and I was thinking about the relationship that I have with my body lately, and those are the same exact words that I've been trying to evolve past my own struggles in my own body and so bringing that awareness bringing that connection bringing that love it's interesting to me how it can relate to the same way that you feel about nature and how you have such a strong sense of self with your environment. And so how did that impact you later in life? You married Alex and he was a big outdoorsman. Yeah. And and you live and you continue to live in Montana correct?
Jenni 15:38
Yeah, we can't we came back to Montana. While we live, we lived here when he was we both came back and finish school here. And then we we kind of had seven years together where we traveled and were adventuring in different places, Europe climbing and all around the US to the different climbing areas. Alaska and then Alex he began to venture out over to the Himalaya too with his alpinum and you know he was getting better and better and more seen within his community. And so I guess in Ada Max was born and and that's when I kind of stepped back from doing quite as many risky activities and decided that being an Alpine climber I was pushing it a little more than I wanted to as a mom and so I I kind of step back a little bit and I still do risky activities in some people's books certainly riding a horse last night I went for a two hour ride with a friend of mine up and up through the woods on my little Five Year Old Quarter Horse and certainly you know that's a risky activity but and I ski and last winter for the first time I had a terrible crash skiing have skied all my life since you know fourth grade but and love it but and I was just at our local beloved Ski Area bridgeable and I had one wrong turn and crashed hard onto my shoulder and broke my shoulder pretty bad break was actually six breaks in the shoulder so one in the humerus and then the shoulder socket was kind of crushed and so went through a big surgery and I'm still getting PT I just came back from PT so it'll be at least probably a year before it feels right or okay according to my surgeon and and that's been that's been a challenge you know, to to injure myself that severely at my age but at the same time I still feel really lucky you know that I'm gonna ski again I'll just ski more slowly and carefully so you know maybe it's too bad I didn't get less severe injury and learn my lesson to maybe slow down a little bit but
Katie Kay 18:46
well you have that adventure Spirit in us since a young age and you're talking about nature and being inspired by it it's hard to withdraw from that I mean, nobody wants to stop doing sports
Jenni 19:00
to me you know I guess I I derive a real thrill from challenging myself you know to do something physical you know whether it's hard to the top of a peak and and I really enjoy that just getting out on hiking trails still pretty often and you know just whether it's a short one with the dogs on the local trails here or you know, all day hike up to a peak and back or a mountain lake and and I love backpacking, I didn't do any this summer with my shoulder, but I'm hoping maybe next summer I can throw a backpack on and see how that feels. And certainly, you know, in in recent years, you know, with the foundation work in Nepal, I've done a lot of trekking in Nepal, which is a nice way to get into the mountains and walk if you love doing that and you know, you can Have a light pack on and your stuff can be carried by local people there who are very happy to have a job doing that and stay in local lodges as you track your way up as many miles as you want to do on a day, into the beautiful high Himalaya where you know, every VISTAs incredible. And so I've traveled to Nepal, in probably as many as 15 times in the last 20 years. So with the work that we we did with the foundation, so, so that I feel really pretty lucky to have done that, and I know that that much flying to Asia definitely had an impact on on climate change. And that in my mind was kind of a trade off for the social work that we were doing to help people in need over there. And so and also just to, you know, have a hand across cultures, you know, it's, it's really great to bridge cultures, and I think it's a, it's a good thing to understand people from different places, and to try to make those relationships happen, just to be in the world, and not be isolated and think only of your own small place. But you know, even right now, oftentimes was COVID. And what's happening with COVID. And climate change, you know, I think of remote cultures, and how much more challenging it is for them right now than, than us right here. With You know, there's so many people who would love to have the vaccine, and who can't get it, you know, tiny percent of their country might be vaccinated. And, you know, they're living in fear of losing family members or their own lives. So
Katie Kay 22:15
I can tell that your, your heart is very big, and you're very sensitive to all of these big topics, climate change, and relationships and bridging over countries and, and I really appreciate that vulnerability, because I think a lot of us have our own sensitivities. But in today's society, it might not be as acceptable, or maybe even a little frowned upon to show that we are sensitive people, and there are these big topics, and you're saying, flying over to Nepal and doing foundation work, and you're still a little worried about the travel and adding climate change. And
Jenni 23:08
we try to we try to put money into a lot of good nonprofits to offset our carbon footprint. And so that's how Conrad and I do it. So we're, you know, we're donating a lot to the environment and in other ways, so, um, which we try to we're trying to make a balanced, you know, impact on the on the planet without being too greedy.
Katie Kay 23:42
Amazing. Can you tell us about your foundation, and just give us a little insight into what that is? Well, so
Jenni 23:49
um, when, when Alex died, I started the foundation with the advice and help of Greg Mortenson who was a good friend, and he had started the Central Asia Institute, and Alex had actually visited some of the schools that Greg built over in Pakistan and was very impressed. And he had talked to me about wanting to do something, you know, to help mountain people because he always connected with the indigenous people in the places that he visited, and it meant a lot to him. Whether he was up with the Inuits or over with the Sherpa, or with the, you know, indigenous people in Pakistan, he, he had relationships with the cooks and the folks who helped them to get their bags to the places they needed to go and he was empathetic and gave them his his time and energy and so on. When he died, and Greg came to visit with me, and he just he talked to me about how it might be meaningful for me to start a foundation in Alex's memory, it just made sense. And, and there were people who wanted to give money to us. And, and I didn't feel completely comfortable with accepting a lot of money for us. And so we had had life insurance, and Alex had taken a calculated risk and being a climber, and so he lost, he lost his life. But I also felt like, okay, you know, we have a supportive community, and I've got life insurance, and I will go forward, I have these three beautiful kids, they're gonna fill my life with love and happiness, I know it and and so the foundation just was a great way for me to kind of pour some efforts and, you know, some some of Alex's spirit into and so our first our first project was in Mongolia. And Greg introduced me to the Mongolian Mountain Club, and we went over there and we built an indoor climbing gym in the city of Ulaanbaatar. And it's a, it's a very severe climate there. And so in the winter time, you know, gave the kids something to do indoors. The kids who were once nomads, but had come to the city for various reasons, and living in this big city. And so we saw how climbing gyms were great in our own communities of, you know, Northern places where it's wintry. And either you do outdoor sports, or you go inside to do something physical and, and so we thought, Oh, that's a great thing. And we'll help their climbing club. And so we did that. And and that was wonderful. And then and then our next big project started in Nepal. And that was Conrad and I tracked over there and we did a Everest base camp track. And on that track, you know, we had a realization that there was waterfalls up in the Khumbu that were frozen in the winter and when no one was working on the mountains as as guides and high altitude workers that they would be available and there was not a ton of training of the high altitude workers at that time. There was only a few who could afford to go to mountaineering schools and or who would leave their villages and go travel to those schools. So we thought well what if we came right to the Khumbu and just taught some climbing seminars up here so started out as just a simple idea we'll see how this goes and then developed into you know, 20 years of courses and then building an extraordinary facility in the little village of forts A, which has a indoor climbing gym, which is a state of the art wall topia gem the highest one in the world and so that's been super nice for them to have during COVID when they were sequestered from the illness and staying in their village you know, village of 300 people or so they they loved you know, the climbing gym, it was a it was a real asset for them and then there's a library there too, and there's a viewing area where the elders can come and watch the kids climb and so it's a community center as well. And so and then the program has really expanded from being kind of simple beginning climbing and knots and safety and you know, simple kind of alpine climbing to more advanced and you know, rescue rigging for rescue, you know, avalanche safety and all kinds of things. So, yeah, it's a good program
Katie Kay 29:44
that's like, so it just fills my heart like, I'm truly blown away by like, just the like, starting from a seed and growing to this amazing, like, it's the foundation is incredible. And what You guys have grown at Community Center. And we were saying it's so needed and COVID. And like how many lives you've changed already,
Jenni 30:10
you know, a lot, a lot of lives have changed. And I think what struck me the most was a couple years ago, uh, to learn that, you know, how many of the indigenous folks who were working on Everest, several 100 had been trained by the KCC. So that was, that was certainly rewarding, and who, who might otherwise not have training, and they would just go get a job and not really even know how to tie it safe. Not so um, so that's, that's all good. And, you know, they may not be international mountain guides, all of them, but, but they have a job that can feed their family and put a roof over their head, and they're much safer than they would have been without any training. So yeah, and, and so, you know, at now, we're at a point where the KCC is registered as a nonprofit in Nepal. And so we're in a transition period Now, over the next few years, where they will take the reins and completely run the facility and program into the future. And and that's kind of the final handoff, you know, which is really the gift of, you know, knowing it can be sustainable. Yeah.
Katie Kay 31:44
Oh, my gosh, I want to go back into that transition point that you're alright, that you are at right now. But I also want to look back at you personally, what that transition was like when Alex died? And what year was that again?
Jenni 32:02
So he died in October of 9999. So October 5, right? Right. At the beginning of the month. Yeah. Yes. So.
Katie Kay 32:11
So during that time, and you started in the foundation started was the foundation for you, having a purpose, having a light having something because I don't want to play any kind of labels on how you're feeling when your husband died, and obviously, very hard time, I can assume you are maybe feeling a little lost. Oh, yeah. Was that like that transition? And what was the foundation for you as it kind of this light that could pull you out? Well, I
Jenni 32:47
think it was, you know, the feeling of, of losing him, as I recall, was just such an abrupt change, you know, it's like, wow, he's gone. I'm never gonna see him again, you know, this is this is it. And so, it was a way to keep him alive a little bit, you know, to, to keep the spirit of what he loved, and what he would appreciate me doing, you know, it to honor him, you know, going, I mean, aside from raising our kids, which was also a way to honor him. And so yeah, it was definitely a difficult time. And I have a tremendous amount of empathy right now, for anyone who's lost a family member to COVID it's, it's terrible to suddenly have someone torn out of your life, especially when you're a young family, and you have expectations that you're going to live out a certain amount of time with this person, then things change. But, um, you know, for me, the the foundation was a way to focus some energy and, you know, keep me busy, and I mean, I was busy anyway, with the kids. And then, you know, being an artist at that time, I had something like five or six galleries that were carrying my work, and so I really wasn't capable of working very much that for six months after his death, but I rallied, you know, later in the spring and then, and I fell in love with Alex's climbing partner, Conrad. You know, we began to fall in love, you know, within months of Alex's death Which was sort of a shocking thing for some people, and including myself, it was surprising. But it was also a way I think that I felt soulless and kind of hanging on to Alex, because they were best friends, they were similar in a lot of way. And for Conrad, I think it gave him a tremendous amount of solace to come up and visit us here and try to help us in different ways. And, and so he began, you know, coming to see us and he wanted to spend spring break with the boys and me and go to Disneyland, because that was something that Alex had envisioned. And so all of this story is kind of in my book, forgot me not. And, and then my son recently created a documentary film that he directed for National Geographic, and it just premiered in telluride about a week ago, and so that will be going around to various festivals, and then possibly have a theater run of eventually be streaming within the next year. So it's called torn to rn. And it's Max's perspective on on those years and walking through grief, and how was life changes? Do we adapt? And so, you know, I might, it might be different now that I'm in my 60s, but then, you know, with these three little kids, I think I felt sort of urgency that Alex was dead, and it didn't seem possible, and I felt vulnerable myself, like, wow, I could be dead, you know, and I better live my life urgently. And so I think that, you know, when Conrad and I began to develop feelings for each other, and, and enjoy spending time together, you know, I think both of us just went with that, because it was a huge solace to the feeling of grief and loss. And, and from my perspective, and I told max this in his interview, it was a it was, for me, I think, an endorsement of my love for Alex to say, you know, it was so worth it to be with you. And even though you're gone now, you know, love is a good thing. It gave me a lot. And so I want to do it again.
Katie Kay 37:47
Yeah, yeah. Seems like you're so full of love in so many ways. I see your Instagram and, and your book, and it's like the horses and, and you sharing the book out? What was that? Why was that so important to you? When did you decide that you wanted to share this story?
Jenni 38:09
Well, I think I decided pretty early on because as soon as Alex died, there were people who were interested in writing a book about him, because he was very well known alpinist at the time. And so I wanted ownership of him. And, you know, I didn't want to let that go to someone else to craft a story of who he was. And so I kept saying, No, no, I don't want you to write a book. I think I can do it. And, and I did not write a book about mountaineering, you know, which is what other people would have written. You know, Alex, the great hero of mountaineering, and all of his accomplishments in the sport in the field. And instead, you know, I wrote a book about who this person was to me, and, and put it out there. And so, it took me a couple years to get going on it. But I started right away, just journaling and writing down memories. And then I had kept journals through some of the years that we were first in love and traveling together. And then Alex had, both of us had written a lot of letters to each other. And so I had literally hundreds of letters from him. So I was able to use those and to create the life that we had shared. And I just really wanted people to see because when he died, there was some pretty big condemnation of both of us for taking risks. And having children, like, people who take risks shouldn't have children, you know? Yeah, it just seemed typical human nature, you know, to, to judge and to call people out on different things. And so so I wanted to defend that and to say, Well, you know, he was an explorer. And yes, he did push limits, and in this way, but you know, but if we didn't have people like that, you know, like Ed Hillary was the first guy to stand on on Everest with Tenzing Norgay, you know, and to make that happen. If we didn't have those kind of people, you know, and the people who went up to the moon, you know, they're a big inspiration for a lot of us to dream, the impossible dream, and to say, Well, I can do this, I can, I can, I'm going to make this happen. I'm going to do this thing. And, and so for me, yeah, Alex was inspiring. He loved life. He wanted to live every minute. And, and that's why I fell in love with him. So
Katie Kay 41:14
yeah, did you feel a sense of relief after writing the book,
Jenni 41:19
I think so it was very cathartic for me to just write the stories and put them all down and, and I really wanted to do it for our boys. so that they could read it later, I knew how young they were, and that they weren't going to remember the man. Because kids memories are only go so far. And I wanted them to have a sense of, of who the guy that that I loved was, and so. So that that was very cathartic for me, I think. And then. So, you know, everyone has their own perspective, certainly. And access perspective in torn is slightly different than my own. That, you know, he was 10 on his dad die. So he did have some memories of him. But certainly, it wasn't like, you know, Alex and I, in our 20s, falling in love and, you know, adventuring and sort of discovering the world together for seven or eight years before starting a family. So
Katie Kay 42:35
I want to go back to when you were talking about it was that abrupt change, and you had all these expectations, and then all of a sudden, all these expectations had completely changed. Yeah, I think just human nature, we live on expectations, and a schedule, and how things are supposed to go and,
Jenni 42:58
and we kind of micromanage our lives, we try to, and we, we think that we can control how things are going to go, but we really have so little control, we can control our immediate environment, you know, to some extent, and, and I love to do that, you know, I create a cozy home. And that gives me a great deal of solace and joy, and maybe a sense of security. even extend that out into my Yard and Garden, you know, having flowers and plants everywhere that I love to see, you know, growing and blooming and, you know, vegetable garden and all those kinds of things. So to some extent, you know, we can be in the in the world and have a little bit of control over what's happening. We can make choices each day about what we do, and, but to some extent, we don't have a lot of control. And like, when my sister got breast cancer, you know, that was a wildly frightening thing. It's like, Oh my god, you know, another moment where you realize just like, you know, she got breast cancer before Alex died. But it's like, wow, this happened to my sister, and, you know, she's young. And it could happen to me that if anything, you know, those kind of reminders are just reminders for all of us that life is short. We only have a little while here. And, you know, it's good to try to do the best we can in that little while. Yeah. And to keep moving forward and that there's so much beauty and good on our precious little planet. And so much joy to be had, and just recognizing all those things.
Katie Kay 45:07
Yeah, yeah. So do you feel like that perspective shift was a very positive. I mean, I just trying to relate to how you going through something that changed your whole life in a matter of a second, and having the new perspective of that, and how it can maybe be a negative thing, but also what you're talking about is gratitude and seeing the beauty and seeing the joy, and how has that shifted your perspective? And, and how do you feel like is it positive is it negative is kind of a mix of different types of emotions,
Jenni 45:49
it's emotions, and allowing yourself to feel them. I mean, certainly I agree, if you know. And to some extent, I still grieve for, you know, all the people I've lost in my life. Both my parents now and I mean, my dear grandmother was the first person who I loved tremendously, you know, to die am and for me to really feel that loss. And, and now, you know, we've lost so many in our community, being in the climbing community, and a part of that, you know, with Conrad, who's still very active in that community. And, you know, having our extended family of, you know, Sherpa climbers, you know, many of those folks, we know, who have lost their lives. And so I think maybe as we get older and older, we realize that death is a big part of life, it's half of life, we are born, and we die. And that's something that we have to wrap our heads around. And the in between parts is the part we have, that we can do something with, and if we're brave enough and courageous enough to love someone, and to forgive them for all of their imperfections, and be open hearted, to their love for us, then, we can live life with a lot of joy. And we can share our lives with those folks who mean something to us, and, and then we just put one foot in front of the other and keep on going and do the things that that, you know, bring us gratitude. And so, as I said, you know, it's just hard not to be an American and feel like, you know, as a white American, I have had a lot of opportunity. And my parents were not wealthy. But being born in this wild state of Montana. And being able to get outside and do the things that I've done. I just feel tremendously lucky. Yeah, yeah.
Katie Kay 48:33
I love how you brought that back to the beginning of our conversation, and that gratitude and joy and I love all those words that you used. I feel like for me, I so easily get wrapped up and expectations. I get wrapped up in control and worried about what other people are thinking. And I think it's common for people to can get trapped in that and so talking with you and hearing about the transitions that you've had in your life and Alex's death, and it brings me a new perspective. With the body breaking free podcast specifically with our bodies, we can get wrapped up in that expectation control, trying to feel a certain way trying to look a certain way. And it's interesting that we can look at it through a new new lens of almost this. It's like we don't have all that control in the world and things can change. So then a split second and I've really noticed the more that I can just surrender so Surrender some of those expectations and I and I liked how you said it expectations don't necessarily have to be a bad thing it's it provides us a sense of safety you said that word safety and that really hit me because I think sometimes it can be a little too safe like we try and protect ourselves too much there's too much fear in the unknown and and so it's like it's almost as balancing act no
Jenni 50:30
and fear and fear I think is what's behind all of the you know, anger that's out there right now. Yeah, anger. And you know, it's driven by fear, fear of losing control or of change that we don't understand. And and it's sad that there are people who use that as a manipulative way to put their own agendas forward. And so it's it's an it's unfortunate but but I do think that you know, vulnerability is a real important thing for all of us to to feel and to look within ourselves for and if you make yourself vulnerable to a stranger you know, it's sometimes kind of surprising what what the connections that you can make that way Yeah. So and, and rewarding I think it can be but um, yeah, I do think that our bodies are kind of vehicles for us to be in the world. And I mean, I've never like when I was really young, I never really thought much about my body I just used it went out and did things and I remember you know, playing on our swingset a lot and hanging from the bars and you know, hanging by your knees and you know, doing all kinds of fun stuff like that with my sisters and swinging and you know, playing on our slide and kind of Monkey borrowing around on the whole thing. So certainly, you know, there was a sense of physicality you know, that that I loved and enjoyed from the time I was little and then in my teenage years I also got into long distance bicycling and and enjoyed you know, challenging myself and seeing Oh, what can I do you know, how far can I go and and so that was that was fun to feel fit. And you know, and same with riding horses You know, it was like wow, you know, look what I can do you know, when I'm on the back of a horse and and this is really cool. And so I think I never really thought that much about how I looked more like what what can I do with my body that's pretty fun and cool. And, and maybe as I evolved into older age, you know, I worried more about my looks when you start to notice, you know, sagging flesh. But then you're kind of like, Oh, well, I guess this happens everybody, you know, it's better than the alternative of not being here, you know? And, you know, there's not a day that I don't think about, you know, my sister isn't here, and I miss her. And you know, she's, she's in my heart, I hold her there, but we had a lot of fun together doing things so I think of those times.
Katie Kay 54:03
Yeah, yeah. what's truly important? Yeah, life is you go to your sister and you think about growing up and no worries of saggy skin are big a video.
Jenni 54:15
No. No, we had a lot of we had a lot of fun. And, and so you know, I love I love you know, just, I think of my life now. You know, I think there's all the life that's behind me, which is wonderful. And I I relish all those memories. And you know, that all the people who were parts part of those memories and then, you know, I think of what might be ahead and and I look to that with hope and you know, excitement for What might be out there to live next, so long as I can be around?
Katie Kay 55:06
And so right now, are you going through any transitions in your life, anything new coming up,
Jenni 55:12
um, you know, I think that our middle son got married this summer, which is really exciting. You know, that's definitely a landmark in life. And, and so I have a daughter in law. And so it feels really wonderful to have the first daughter and in my family have lots of wonderful other young lady friends and relatives, but that that's special. And and then, you know, as the boys have girlfriends, it's been just so much fun to, you know, have them be part of our life. And I think that both Conrad and I are really enjoying living life vicariously through our kids. And to me, that's what eternal life is, you know, you see the next generation coming along, and you rejoice and, you know, their challenges and goals and accomplishments. And you know, you support them and encourage them and, and, you know, live life through the next generation. So that's, that's a kind of a transition, I guess. Special. Yeah, it's pretty, it's pretty special. Yeah.
Katie Kay 56:34
So that's amazing.
Jenni 56:37
I'm there. I mean, I'm, I'm embracing being the old lady on the block. And I love a lot of our neighborhood kids too.
Katie Kay 56:49
Fun, great place to be at.
Jenni 56:51
Yeah, yeah. And I like last night, I went riding with a girl who's less than half my age, and she's got her horse out where I keep my horse and, and we just had such a wonderful couple of hours together, wandering up through the changing foliage in the forest, and looking at all the reds and yellows, and oranges that are popping out and in, and kind of rejoicing in autumn. And, you know, everything. And she's a she's also an amazing gardener. And so we share that love of flowers and wild flowers and everything. So just those moments that you know, you can share with another human being, no matter whether they're just a casual friend, or a really close friend, or a part of your family. Yeah,
Katie Kay 57:44
so my friend, that's, for me being out in nature, I can just I can access those moments have so much gratitude. I was, I feel so lucky to be in Bozeman right now, because I was out on the trail this weekend and seeing the leaves change. And it's just said, that's just that light to be able to be outside and
Jenni 58:05
yeah, yeah, yeah. So if we can find the commonalities, you know, that we have with other folks. And you know, and then share our, our concerns and our worries with them. And it always lightens the load. So yeah,
Katie Kay 58:24
well, thank you for sharing with us today. Yeah, being here. And is there are there any last words or messages that you'd like to share with our audience before we leave?
Jenni 58:40
No, I would say pay attention to what you eat. That's a that's something that I tried to do. Because you know, after Jan, got cancer, and my mother also died of cancer, I started thinking more about eating organic and shying away from what's so easy in America's to just jump on the fast food wagon and eat what everybody you know, eats and not pay attention. But you know, you can you can still enjoy all the favorite foods that you love. But if you're buying foods that are organically grown, or sustainably grown, and that they're not harming the planet as much then then you're doing a really good thing for your body and for the future of the next generation.
Katie Kay 59:39
Yeah, that's beautiful. I'm so glad he brought that up. Because I've noticed now if I'm treating my body with what I feel like a real true nutrients is it's a different mindset that you have around food as yeah giving yourself a gift.
Jenni 59:56
It is it is a gift, writing your nutrients. If you're in a place where you can even have a little postage stamp of a vegetable garden, that's a whole lot of fun to just grow some of your own food and see, see what fun that is. Yeah, it's a great thing to do with your kids. So Oh,
Katie Kay 1:00:13
love it. Great, great last message. Well, Jenny, thank you so much. And I'll put some contact information, maybe your website or whatever you would like in the show notes so he can reach out to you if they need to. And I'm just so grateful for the time that you spent with me today and our listeners.
Jenni 1:00:35
Oh, thank you for coming. It was my joy.
