46. Elevate Your Life With Yoga / Denise Druce
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Denise Druce has been inspiring people to live healthier, happier lives. Her students refer to her as ‘The Elevator…when you’re around her, you’re going up! She teaches her students to stand at the “Soft Edge of the Hard Place” in fitness and in life. Her non-profit Yoga Forward is “taking yoga where it isn’t”…prisons, shelters, schools, and shopping malls. Her greatest life teacher was her journey with breast cancer. It taught her that humans can do hard things and it’s possible to do them with grace and ease. Episode Topics: Katie Kay's story with Denise, Eight Limbs of Yoga, Energy & Chakras, Non-profit Yoga Forward, Yoga for everyBODY.
Katie Kay
Today, we have Denise Druce on that episode, thank you so much Denise, for being here on body breaking free podcast,
Denise Druce
you are so welcome. And I've been a fan listening all the way through your journey. And it's really an honor to be here with you, Katie.
Katie Kay
Awesome, thank you for saying that. And that means so much to me, I'm definitely a little nervous right now got to get it out. Um, because Denise means so much to me and my life. And that's how I want to start this episode. Because I feel like it's a pretty profound moment right now in my life being able to be here. And Denise was at the top of my bucket list of people that I really wanted to interview when I started this podcast. And it took me a little time to work up the courage to, to ask her and it just is because Denise has really had such a profound impact on how I treat my body and my relationship to my body now. And I think that it's just, it's hard to really put into words, and I was trying to think about it before, before coming here. And it's almost wordless, because it's really based in kind of this energy. And sometimes when it's really big and profound in that way, and it's energy based, it can be hard to describe, but I'm going to try and do my best. And I also think that there's so many people listening right now, and just so many people that have been impacted by you, Denise that I want to do it justice. And I think that a lot of people probably have something very similar to my story, or, you know, the same kind of underlying theme of how much that you have influenced people's lives through yoga. And so yeah, the only way I can really describe Denise and her impact in my life is just having this very powerful and intentional and almost fierce conviction to her. And that kind of just like that radiates such an amazing energy. And then at the same time, it's, it's a lot of grace. And it's almost this softness, and a lot of compassion and love at the same time. So if you can imagine that radiating out of somebody, that's how I would describe Denise and it's also timing, I feel like when I first met Denise and our relationship, how she was brought into my life was a time that I just, like really needed her. And I stepped into that yoga class that was the first yoga class I had ever taken. And at that time, I just really I had a really hard relationship with my body and reflected into myself as well. And I you know, I would almost even say like I I wasn't connected at all and I really didn't feel comfortable in my own skin and maybe from the outside i i look different like I looked like I had it all together. And in the inside I was really broken and going through a period of time were really depressed and contentment was a little far reaching for me just to feel content in my body and space. And so when I stepped into that yoga room, I was motivated by you know, burning calories and exercise and exercise was the was the one thing that really did make me feel better and maybe my motivation going into yoga wasn't actually what I got out of it because I think what I got out of it was just, I guess that just being me just allowing myself to be exactly as I am. And you can see now that I've gotten to a place where I feel empowered and myself and starting a podcast you know, getting into that uncomfortable space and breaking out of my cocoon. But yeah, I just I'm starting with a story because I think that I just want to show that this like being here with Denise is I will remember it forever and I in her influence in my life has meant so much and and so this is this is a big moment. This is a big moment for the podcast. Emmy and I know a lot of people feel the same way. So, Denise.
Denise Druce
So thank you for starting us off with me on the verge of tears. I'm so grateful to you, Katie, for your honesty, your vulnerability, and just what an honor, you know, those words are and I, as you said, I don't really have words, it's because your life is is doing the talking, your life is speaking volumes. And as a teacher, there is nothing I could ask for greater than to see someone just walking into the life that's been calling them all along and being in service of others. And you are, you really are standing in your footprints so beautifully right now. And just really living in the skin that maybe was hard for you to live in, in the past. And and then speaking to other people that can really relate, I'm so grateful for that. And so I in no way want to deflect anything you said I receive it graciously, and I'm so grateful. And I want to also add that it wasn't me it was yoga that came into your life, and I just got to be the vehicle, I got to be the vessel the the placeholder that was there. Thank goodness at the right time, when you walked into that door, because it was my job maybe to make you feel comfortable to invite you into that space to have some familiarity and some recognition. But beyond that, you allowed yourself to step into this big, magical transformative work world called Yoga. And you allowed it to do its work in you. And that's what's happening. That's why we're here today. Because you you stepped into that world.
Katie Kay
Thank you, Denise. And I would Yeah, I would 100% agree, I think that when you step into the yoga room, it is a reflection of your internal world and condition and you start to break down the walls. And I've heard you want to say that yoga, his definition is to yoke and to bring together and I've also heard you talk about breaking down the little self that is in all of us. And coming back home to that place our higher self that place within that is that essence of love and soul being and and that's yeah, that's the experience that I went through. And just like piece by piece each time I showed up on my mat, and I didn't even really know what was going on and why I kept showing up and but I do fully embrace and understand that your, as a messenger is so powerful. And without you, it's you and I know like there's so many powerful yoga teachers out there. And, and I just fully embrace all of them and saying that it's it has to take somebody to give that to us to be able to push through those walls and really, like really enjoy the full essence that yoga has to offer. And yeah, and so I guess my first question would be, how, how did you figure out that yoga was just 100% your passion, what you wanted to put your full self into. Because I see this fierce conviction within you. And there's something about that when somebody is fully in where they're meant to be or where they're putting their energy into. And it's like reading out this. It's like energy of confidence. But it's so much more than that. How did you end up like knowing this is exactly where you were meant to be and what you wanted to do with your your full life work?
Denise Druce
That's a great question. And I have to take you back 40 years to fully answer that question.
Perfect. I love it. Let's go back.
Denise Druce
Just because for 20 years, yoga was not on my radar, but I was doing what I do, which is opening spaces for people to step in and move their bodies and my message has always been the same. I didn't have the yoga language to express it in but just feeling more comfortable in your own skin. And when you take time for yourself you always leave feeling better. So my message has always been around self esteem and self love and self care and take time for you and a stronger body is a it provides a happier life for us. Right? So that was 20 years of me doing that whether it was on a bike on a step on shag carpeting with bare feet or with weights in our hands, I just luckily found a lot of ways to do that. And then yoga came along. And that was 20 years into my fitness career, it was 20 years ago. Yoga came along at a time in my life, when I was just starting, I was a young mother. And so it was, it felt really good to my body to, to slow down a little bit. So it was it was personal for me at first, I probably had a similar experience to yours going into yoga, even with my background. Little by little, you know, through the years of continuing to do fitness, and always kind of beating up my body one day, yoga invited me the next day to slow down and take care. And then as you know, I'm a breast cancer survivor. And that was really pivotal for me. I had been teaching yoga for a long time, but I don't think I really truly fell in love with the deep philosophical truths of yoga until I got into a dark place. And it was at that dark place where the edges got hard and things got scary that I really turned to the wisdom, just the wisdom of that yoke, that connection, that union, like who is this big self, and who is this little self and so that I think that's when I knew. I think that's when I knew that it was really my calling, and I still do the fitness things. But I now I bring yoga messages into my fitness classes.
Katie Kay
I'm gonna have to come to those two, I guess. Yes. So how would you describe yoga, maybe to somebody that's new to it, or maybe just kind of your own definition of it. And to our listeners?
Denise Druce
Well, I would be surprised if any of your listeners didn't know about yoga. But if it was just a person on the street, I'll use the example I always do have the gentleman I met at a bar in Fort Bridger, Wyoming in his muddy boots in his overalls. And he called it yogurt. So I heard about that yogurt thing, what is that, and I just asked him to sit with me and take a few deep breaths. And notice that he was breathing. And I said, That's yoga, you're doing yoga, your mind is paying attention to what your body is doing right now. And if I asked you to put your arm here, or your neck here, or your leg here, that's just another way to breathe and listen to your body. And I saw I literally saw like, he got it. You know, he understood like what yoga was it, it doesn't mean putting your leg behind your head, it doesn't mean putting on the cutest outfit you can find in your closet and accomplishing anything. It's are you breathing? Are you aware that you're breathing? And is your mind paying attention to what's happening in your body? And then that's yoga.
Katie Kay
Yeah, that's a great definition. I love that and the practical use just the breath like the most powerful way to connect to the body and and I remember in one of the classes it was a big point of transition for me my relationship to my body was laying in savasana and you told us to place our hands on our belly and you know the stomach belly like that can be a sensitive area for somebody that's like doesn't feel good in their body and and I felt that contentment at that time and obviously you know like tears like you've seen me cry in class many times but yeah, that was the first time I got really emotional and and who like didn't even know that was gonna happen that day you know you show up on your mat have no idea like some days suck some days are amazing. And then that day it was Yeah, bit by bit I got to that point. I want to get into why was yoga like so pivotal for you, when you were going through that dark time, that dark place and breast cancer maybe other times in your life? Because you've I've heard story like you've told stories in your classes and and one thing that I really respect about you is just being so honest and truthful and I still remember times where you talked about being in yoga and it felt like there are barbed wires around your heart and each time you came into that heart opening it was like each one breaking open. And I also remember you talking about your throat and having a constriction there and and then realizing it was connected to being able to speak your truth. And I think I remember those moments in class so much because you were you know sharing your your vulnerability But yeah, like going through those big life like big life moments and really hard stuff. I mean, like breast cancer, like that dark the darkest times, and how is that reflected into yoga? And like, how did you really transition out of that and come into it such a profound place now?
Denise Druce
Man, let's just go deep, shall we dive in here? I think I want to answer that by Well, what's coming up for me is actually something that I learned early on in my journey with breast cancer. And as you know, I had a really good friend that very early on in my diagnosis, she suggested that I view yoga as my teacher, instead of my attacker, or my enemy, right, something to conquer. And so I did have a different relationship with cancer all the way through of like, you know, schools in session, it's going to be a hard semester, let's do this, right? I got lucky to be in that space. And so I heard a quote from tick, not Han, the Vietnamese Buddhist monk, and it was so simple. And he said, breathing in, I know that I have a body. And who is this eye that has a body. And I think up until then I had and you just said it yourself. Like, I wasn't comfortable in my own body. I have this switch in my mind. Like, I'm not in my body. Like I am I and I'm having an experience fueled by the vehicle of this body. But that's, that's really not me. It's just the car. I'm driving right now. And this car has, you know, a couple dents. In the front of it. This car like is limping along on it needs a new engine or something, but it's not me. And so I was able to look through those lenses because of yoga of like, okay, how am I going to show up today, here's this body doing these things, and having this experience and surgeries and treatments. And and then here's I observing it all. And that was not possible without yoga. That really is the true essence of that word yoga to unite this little self that currently has breast cancer and is undergoing treatment, and the big self that's aware of this loving awareness, watching it all happen. And I really think from that day forward, I got that message that I no longer feel like I live in my like, I'm trapped in this body that's aging. Because I would say Katie right now I'm probably in another one of those spaces. I wouldn't call it a dark place, but a definitely a space of transition. I'm almost 60 I just became an empty nester, my husband and I are trying to rewrite our relationship of what it means to be a couple again minus our parenting activities. And all like what has come back to me flooding back as body image. I'm now aware again of this aging body that I live in and I catch myself back into old habits of being critical and comparing and trying to take pictures from the right angle and filters and all this stuff that we ridiculous things that we do. But I'm finding myself cycling back there again. And that's probably bad news for someone that wants to you know, just check the box and be done with that. I just have to remember this this 60 year old body is not me this is like I am I and I'm living in a body that's got some miles on it now how can I take the best care of this body now?
Katie Kay
Really powerful because obviously all of our bodies are going to be changing and death is it's going to happen to each and every one of us and gosh like I don't want to get morbid or anything but I'm talking about the dark times in life I think it's really valuable to see our fears behind that and and I just love her talking about creating that space. And it's almost like a relief like I drop my shoulders down a little bit and even in the darkness it's like I can see that space from the little self to this amazing like big like fills up the bigger than this entire room. Soul being that is a view and yeah, I just love that perspective of the body being this vessel and it's a card carrying us around in life and yeah, I think like The fear is ever so much more present when we're really attached on to the body. And oh my gosh, what a whirlwind is that because the body is so unpredictable.
Denise Druce
Like if you look at a picture of yourself from 10, if you don't believe your body is changing, like right now at the rate of millions of cells per second, like, as we say, Here, we're dying. And, and I love the saying, like, we don't start living until we realize that we are dying every day of our lives. And literally right now, since I've said this last sentence, a million cells in my body just died. And they're being replaced by new cells, like it's this constant death and rebirth, death and rebirth. And there is beauty and freedom when we when we just come to terms with that and be at peace with that and just decide like, here's where I am right now I'm going to live, I'm just choosing to be alive right now, in this moment in the fullest way that I can.
Katie Kay
Oh, I love that. And I saw that email that you sent out today and setting a mantra. And there's something in there that was like, it was living powerfully in the moment, how can we live powerfully in the moment, and it kind of just like, drew me back a little bit because, you know, we get my heads down and I get stuck in the mud. And I am focusing on the little things. But there is so there's so much more expansiveness and space when we can look up and really understand the power of life in itself. And just like all the craziness that is with it. And like I was driving here, and oh my gosh, I just couldn't, my little ego just wasn't even there. I couldn't even believe just the amount of gratitude. I could, you know, today, it's like, oh, I take this breath. And then of course, there's like, Rascal Flatts playing in my car, like the best lyrics ever. But like, just like the moment like the little moments that I get like that. Maybe they're far and few in between, but more and more, and especially as I practice on my mat. You know, not it doesn't even have to be the physical practice, but even just like meditation, and the more that I'm like, present fully present in the moment. It does take away some of that darkness. And it Yeah, it's a Oh, no, I just imagined almost like looking up like looking up as opposed to looking down at my feet. That's like, the only way I can really describe it. It's a
Denise Druce
beautiful way to describe it. And if it's okay, can I share with you one of the things that we you know, that I do work in the prison. And one of the things that we say just across the board in every class that we teach there is this idea of your past is finished with you. There, you have no business back there. It's done. Like why are you lingering back there that the built you know, the building is closed, right, the bartender left, it's time to move on. And, and the future is not yet ready for you. And so all of our depression and regret that lives in the past, anxiety, worry, stress lives in the future. And so when we're feeling one of one of those emotions, or more, we're not present. But we if we can learn to be where we are, feel our feet on the ground, or button a chair, the temperature of air on our skin, it doesn't matter what's happening around us, life is perfect in that moment, whether Rascal Flatts is playing or not, whether the sun is shining, or snows coming down, it doesn't matter. Because in the present moment, anything else is just worry or regret. And those are future and past. So can you imagine how that sounds to someone who's incarcerated. Their whole life is like regret and worry. And then just to be in that moment, and like, oh, you know, I'm next to this person that really cares about me, I'm practicing yoga, that temperature is fine. I just had lunch, you know, I'm gonna have a visit the stuff whatever, I'm present.
Katie Kay
It's such a beautiful perspective. And I'm so glad that you brought up the work that you do in the prisons, because I definitely want to dive into that and just the experience that you have with that. But I want to Yeah, I want to hit on that point one more time because I like I do sometimes feel selfish in my privileges that I have. The environment I grew up in the the wealth I have in my life, the color of my skin, those things but then I you know, I kind of have to step back from that because I think I also place a judgment on myself and and realize that we are all one and and just the way that you were describing the prison inmates and the ability of being very in this present moment. I love that reflection. As far as in this present moment, we are all the same. And this breath, we all get to breathe this one breath. And so it takes me out of my head and not saying I'm not fully grateful for everything that I have in my life. But I don't want to use that as a smokescreen to also push away like my own problems and fears that I carry within. And I think, yeah, I guess I don't even know why I brought that up. But maybe somebody needed to hear it. Like we all share so much. And in the present moment, we can all maybe see that a little bit more clearly. Whatever circumstances you are in your life, and in what you were talking about the light times in the dark times, yeah. Yeah. And, and so go ahead. And I know, I just cut you off. But yeah, I would love to hear more about the the work that you do in the prisons, and what do you do? And then also, what is your experience with that?
Denise Druce
You that was just a beautiful segue to it. That's exactly what we do is just try to help people who are incarcerated, you know, realize we are all one, you know, see their connection to the greater whole. And now, everything you said was great. And I just I really want to underscore what you said, the fact that you hold awareness of the place you stand as, as a woman, a white woman, who probably has lived in some cases in some privilege. We all need to, we all need to come to the line of that awareness. And then once we do it doesn't do anyone any good to feel guilty. That doesn't serve anyone. So what what am I going to do with this is really the question that we ask ourselves, How can I best serve. And I think what you just said is the best way I've learned to serve, which is I I'm learning to see others. Like, and I mean, that in the biggest sense of the world, I really see other people. And that's my job in the prison is I feel like just the ability to make eye contact with them to use their first name instead of their, their inmate number and their last name, which is how they're known there. To see them as a human being was infinite potential. And I don't care what you did, I don't want to know what how you got here. I, I just I want to know what you're doing today, and how I can help you move forward. So we do yoga, we teach yoga in the women's and men's prison in Utah. We have a team of volunteers, that through COVID, we got shut down. But we're headed we're going back in now. And we're opening up the classes again. And we are on our second round of training yoga teachers in the prison. And so training people, some who are serving life sentences, they'll be there the rest of their lives, but they are, we're giving them these pieces of knowledge and information, so that they can serve the women or men that they're incarcerated with for the rest of their lives. And they're all it's just so cool to see them just stepping into their skin, you know, stepping into their purpose and finding just like that past and future conversation. Well, here's where I am. For all the good and all the bad of it. So what what can I do while I'm here? How can I serve? Who can I be in this moment that that raises the vibration and serves humanity?
Katie Kay
It's so cool, what you guys are doing there, and I just am blown away. And I always tell I always love to tell people and have you seen the nice truce and what she's doing in the prisons. And and I also think that there's a really amazing backstory to all of this. And if you're willing to share your own personal background and why you show up in the prisons and do what you do.
Denise Druce
Because I had a really good teacher who challenged me once that if you want to know where you're supposed to be serving in the world, go to your wounds go to the place where you've had pain. And the story is my dad was in prison for 15 years when I was a kid. And that was definitely a dark place for me. The years surrounding that he was an alcoholic and those 15 years were three different sentences. And so just the in and out the embarrassment of having a parent that was incarcerated I lied. I didn't tell and like a lot of my closest friends didn't know. So yeah, those were the dark years and And he passed in 2016, I think. And sorry, 2018 2018. Yeah. And that just opened the doors, I think, to my mind in my heart that that was where I was supposed to serve. And I wasn't really ready to do it while he was still alive, I guess. And then as soon as he moved on, I wrote an email. And it was just such a quick Yes, from the prison that one thing led to another and here we are. But it's, I definitely, strongly encourage people to do that, like, whatever has been your struggle in the past. Look there. Because when you find your way back to that place in service of others who are suffering with that same thing, you realize that it's almost like it had to happen, like that pain from your past becomes your purpose. And I had a student the other day, just say, I'm so in the middle of my pain right now, I can't even imagine going back into those spaces. And I said, then you're not ready, it took me 40 years, it literally took me 40 years to get the courage and that to do the therapy and the self work where I could go back and face that. So give it time, and be patient with yourself. But just know that if you're in a hard place right now, and you're struggling, like you mentioned earlier, like disordered eating, or if you have addiction issues or relationship, whatever it is, know, in your heart, there's a pretty good chance that your soul is in school right now. And your soul is learning a lesson. In the only way souls can learn lessons by going through the hard things. So that someday you'll be a lighthouse for someone else in that same place.
Katie Kay
Oh my gosh, it's so good. It's so good. And there's so many things I just want to grab on to. But yeah, I think like for me and that message. So I took to let the listeners a little background story, I tucked any screws, yoga teacher training through yoga assets. And that was a really big part of the program was that kind of self reflection. And it was a lot of inner work. And I just love that, that kind of that transformation that I had during that. And that part of showing up for your most painful parts. And that's it for me, it was I mean, what I was telling you going to Denise's class, when I was in college, it was college, that was my hardest time. And that's when, you know, the the depression and you know, dropping out of school and trying to just get my shit together. And the anxiety and, and all of that, and it's just so common, but yeah, for me, it was, yeah, showing up for those the students. And so I, I, you know, drive 30 minutes to go down to the University of Utah and teach. And that's, it does, I think, for me as well, it just fills my heart so much, because I see all the little Katie's in the room. And yeah, and the way that I know now coming out of that, what kind of messages and basically direct reflection of what Denise was telling me at that time. And what I needed to hear is what I also give out, and now and so I think there's so much truth. And I know we're all kind of trying to find our purpose and figure out how to show up best in this world. And that whole message of finding where your dark places are and moving in that direction that just changed everything for me. And with a podcast and everything that like I always say, you know, I don't know what I'm doing. I'm gonna just take it one day at a time. Like, I don't think anybody really knows what they're doing. But even just looking at you, Denise, it's like all the steps that you took. And now I'm sure you can look back and really just be like, Wow, look at all that I've done and look at all the people that I've impacted, whether it's like through yoga, teacher training and the prisons, and I mean, yeah, also your nonprofit yoga forward. That is also let's get into that because this is like we're just celebrating Denise today. I love it. I love it. I've been my birthday. It should be. I just Yeah, it's so cool. And we got it We got to get into all the cool stuff that you're doing. So I'm taking yoga where it isn't prisons, we talked about shelters, schools, shopping malls. Tell us about yoga forward and all that work that you're doing there.
Denise Druce
Yes. And by the way, I hope that by the time you're 60, you have a million things to look back on to because that's what happens when you age, you just have a really big Trail of History. So part of it is just the fact that I've survived to age 60. Yoga forward is a nonprofit that we formed to help our students who are out there doing all of their community service work. That's part of the requirement, as you know, of our teacher training, that we asked our students to go out and serve at least 10 hours in an area where there's not access, typically to yoga. And we realized a lot of our students did were teaching in places where there were no yoga mats or blocks, or there wasn't a space, or they needed a little space heater, because it was freezing. And so we just started collecting donations in a 501. C three to support our teachers. And it blew up to the point where now we're doing yoga teacher training for, like I said, the prison, we're working now with prison officers in the new prison, they've given us eight mindfulness rooms for the officers that we get to equip so that when there's been, you know, some kind of a conflict or an emergency or an escalation, an officer can go into a room, dim the lights, put on some meditation, take some deep breaths, do a couple stretches, get, you know, kind of into their body, and then step out of that room, ready to go on to the next thing. And that does not happen in our correctional facilities. It's one thing after another, and those guards those officers carry with them so much. And so that's one place. We are working in the schools, we've been able to do a lot of work with school teachers, which during the last two years have had, I think the world's worst job maybe behind, you know, health care workers. And we've helped them with meditations and breathing and practices they can take into their classrooms, so the students can be a little more calm and focused. So that's, that's where we work. We did a scholarship program for our bipoc community, and trained 20 People of Color, to go out into their communities and be leaders in mindfulness and yoga. And we've done a scholarship program with our LGBTQ community, and again, just equipped them. Because you know, I'm not an effective teacher in those communities. For the reasons you said earlier. My job is to train the people who are the speakers and the spokespeople for their own communities. And so that's what yeah, that's what we get to deal for. Call it a job.
Katie Kay
For me. Amazing. And this is perfect. leads me right into the next question is, you always say yoga is for every body? And why is yoga? Or how is yoga for every body?
Denise Druce
It's a great question, because you wouldn't like there are many who disagree with me. And if you don't believe that, open Instagram, and just do hashtag yoga, and you will see that yoga is predominantly for one, one kind of body. And it's typically a thin, affluent white female, between the age of 18 and 35. That's the demographic of yoga in the West. And that's what a lot of people think yoga is. And while those people need yoga, it's not making its way to the rest of our population. And so when we say yoga is for every body, we're trying to make yoga more accessible. And we're changing the language as much as possible in our training so that yoga is accessible to a larger body, or a body with disabilities or an aging body or a pregnant body or a child. We yoga really want if I can speak like in this weird language way, like yoga wants, you know, yoga, like body. Yoga wants to reveal itself to every human being, I believe. And I've got plenty of Yoga people behind me that would back that up smarter than me. Yoga wants to reveal itself to every person, every human being walking this earth because it is the path to reconnect with our our best and brightest selves. And when we do that, we're better human beings and we're better in relationship with each other. Humanity is better. So if yoga has become this thing, where you have to have enough money to take a class or you need to have transportation to take a class or you need to have look good in your Lululemon pants to take a class, whatever it is, we were serving, I don't know 10% of our population. So So we try to make yoga Yes, for everybody. And, you know, the simplest way to do that is to just welcome people of all bodies into our spaces. And just just welcome all. And the next way is, if you're a yoga teacher, and you're listening, we really recommend that you start a pose at its most easy and accessible level. And then layer options up from there so that everyone in the room has a place where they can stay, as opposed to showing this big beautiful dynamic pose and and saying, This is such harsh language. If you can't do this, run over to the closet, grab yourself a block, make a fool of yourself and sit sit in the corner and shame while I do this big beautiful bows. And you see that a lot. So we teach we teach the other way, make it a yes for everybody.
Katie Kay
I love that. And I do think that I fall into the trap sometimes as a Yoga Instructor in Park City. Like I want, I guess I would say, is a very athletic community. And sometimes it does fit kind of that stereotype. Not saying that's bad or anything. But yeah, I do think it's very powerful to always remember that. It's not so much about the yoga poses, because I feel like I get the most benefit from just being on my mat and getting those messages of compassion. And I can do hard things. And yeah, and so I always kind of have to remind myself, it's not so much about the poses. And it really should be a yes, for everybody. And I know, I talked to my parents, and they're definitely listening. Hi, Mom, Dad. And they don't do yoga, which I'm totally 100% respect, but I don't want them to ever feel like they can't do yoga. And just like you were saying, when if they went online, and they looked up, like yoga poses and doing yoga, yeah, they would probably 90% of the time find something that wouldn't feel good in their body. Because they, you know, can't, like they wouldn't be able to do that, like crazy pose that 90% of us can't do anyways. So
Denise Druce
I shouldn't do probably in showcases.
Katie Kay
Exactly. But what you taught me in your classes is that that same message of it's the more basic like the just the starting at that level, and then kind of building up and I never felt like we were going super fast, like super power in your classes, even though I felt like amazing after. And so I always kind of have to remember like, what are those key components that totally transformed my life? And yeah, I think it's just like really, really profound for for yoga instructors and for students just to kind of keep that in mind. And, and also know that there's so many different options and variations. And so if one class doesn't feel good, then there's always other other places they can go. And so and that's an also have to hit on this for my parents is, and anybody else that is new to yoga is the eight limbs of yoga. And can you describe that just a little bit, and that yoga can also be not about the actual physical form or physical poses?
Denise Druce
Yeah, yoga, as taught by Patanjali. In the Yoga Sutras is literally it's eight limbs and the physical poses is just one of those branches. So we like to joke and say that branch fell off the tree, you know, a couple 100 years ago, and it made its way to the west and we think we have the whole tree. And if you're teaching like you said to athletes, you kind of have to you kind of have to meet people where they are. And if people are coming in, I think a lot of Westerners do come in because they want the physicality of it. That's how you started. And so there is a there's a happy medium there where we do have to keep our students attention. They didn't come to a meditation class. I it My secret is you came to a breathing class with a site of movement. We're going to do a lot of breathing and we'll move your body a little bit along the way but I do think we have to we got to meet people where they are. So the eight limbs is a lot like what we talked about at the beginning, Katie helping people go from little eye to big eye. And at the bottom of the tree is little eye with all of our worries and concerns and we got our head down, like you said, and at the top of the tree we become our best and brightest selves in Light and men is the word you know, that's used sometimes for that awakening. And we're we arrive at our big self. So the eight limbs are suggestions from ancient Yogi's as to how we can get there. And there are things like ethical practices, how we treat each other how we are in relationship with other people. How, here's some suggestions for how you can have a better relationship with yourself. And for the terms of your podcast, those knee aamas are exactly what you teach and preach like purity. Like let's take care of this beautiful vessel called the body let's, let's, let's eat clean let's move clean. Let's let's like worship this sacred body that we live in, right? And santosha is that practice of contentment, like, this is the body I have at age almost 60 Can I be content here on top of discipline, getting myself out of bed in the morning when I don't feel like getting out going for that power walk and doing some yoga. So those are, that's kind of the bottom of the tree. And then we move up into the asana, the breath work. It teaches us how to concentrate how to focus our mind on one thing. And at the top of the tree, we end up in that beautiful place called quiet mind where we're not distracted by our crazy, busy monkey mind. But we're just like, we're like a still like, peaceful and calm.
Katie Kay
I was perfect explanation. Thank you for diving into that a little bit. Because I think it's important to and I Sterling, my husband, sometimes I say, or we've talked about meditation before and he said, you know, mountain biking is my meditation. And I think that that's such an expansive way of looking at it as well as that we all are doing probably yoga, if we're doing some of that self care, inner work, connecting to our inner wisdom. That is yoga. So if you don't think you're a yogi, maybe you are a little bit of a yogi. Did you say Sterling? Yes. Yeah,
Denise Druce
I think he's absolutely right. And what's really cool is if you take the word meditation, and you separate it out from the act of formal meditation, that we would picture somebody sitting on a cushion, closing their eyes, putting their fingers together, versus what he's describing as the state of meditation, the place where you arrive at the single focused mind. And athletes call it the flow state. I think it's the exact same thing. Like all everything else falls away, and you are one with whatever it is that you're that you're doing. I think he's right.
Katie Kay
I think so tail, nailing it, showing me up.
Denise Druce
My husband does that too, though. People say do you do yoga, and now he knows just enough to be dangerous. And he says, Yeah, I do the other seven limbs.
Katie Kay
Oh, gosh, course, Sterling Delve, listen to this podcast. Don't get to but Oh, I love that. And so within yoga as well. I also want to talk a little bit about the energy body and the chakras. And I remember you once told me that you scientists can literally take images of the human body and see the energy layers radiating out. And there's just so much science. And sometimes people need that kind of knowledge to back up the the whole concept of energy and, and chakras and maybe even getting into this topic, we can talk a little bit about your experience with your throat. And your story with that, because that the throat chakra is definitely one that I think about a lot. But and you don't certainly don't have to go into your story if you don't want to. But yeah, a little bit about the the energy side of yoga.
Denise Druce
Okay, how much time do we have? Five hours,
I keep you forever,
Denise Druce
because we could go so many directions. Let me see if I can be concise about this. So let's first bring in the non believers, people like my husband that have to see it under a microscope in order for it to be real. So no one will argue that we are energy beings, there's just too much science around that. And if you think this table is solid, you're wrong. Like it's just molecules vibrating together at a faster rate than the back of my hand. And that's just vibrating faster than what's this water in this glass, right? We're all just molecules held together and formed. So to think that we're not energy, it's just plain wrong. Right? This body that we're in right now is about 99% space, and it's little neutrons and electrons buzzing around and trillions of cells. So if we can all agree on that, then we can agree that we live in this big superconductor of energy. And it were like, you know, think of an electrician just wiring your house, you've got your brain and you've got your spine and your spinal cord that feeds you know, plugs into every part of the body and you flip switches and lights go on and energy turns on. And we that's, that's who we are. Right? And so let's, let's just all stand right there and agree that we are, we're energy beings. Okay, so now we talk in yoga terms of the chakras and the energy centers in our body. And we have to veer a little bit from science in order to have this conversation. If we look at these as the nerve bundles up and down the spine, we can stay with Western science, there's like my heart and lungs are fed by the brachial plexus, the nerves that feed heart, long shoulders, arms and hands, right. My hips and legs and feed are fed by the coxa GL Plexus, a bundle of nerves that feeds down there. So, so far, so good, we got the non believers and the woowoo people together. Okay, so now we're going to take step over to the woowoo side. And we're going to call those nerve bundles, bundles, chakras. And we're going to say that for the sake of this conversation, there are seven but there are other people that teach that there are eight and 12, and three, like there are a lot of different philosophies, because this is not something you can see under a microscope. So let's just imagine then that these seven nerve bundles of the body each has a relationship to that part of the body. And with it comes emotions that have been stored in the body and properties. Let's also assume or let's imagine for a moment that these nerve bundles these energy centers formed as we developed as human beings. So let's just imagine that our root chakra formed when we were in our mother's womb, and we were learning our bodies were learning about safety, security and stability. So if that was a safe time and place, and we were brought into a world where there was comfort and safety and protection, chances are our root chakra is pretty healthy, we're grounded, we're stable, we know where we stand, we're not anxious and flighty and moving all the time and changing jobs every day, right, we're settled. But if we came into a world that was a little less settled, we might find ourselves as adults bouncing around a lot, unable to ground ourselves. So that's just an example. And we can talk about each center in that way. For the sake of time, I won't today but we'll move up to the fifth chakra, the throat chakra, because that really is what sold me on the magic of this work. And it might not be magic, it might just be the lens that I was able to look through to know myself better. And so we did, as you know, in our trainings, we do artwork, and we kind of try to do we do meditations and draw what we see here. And what I saw was a map of my body where I had a lot of physical problems in the neck area. So a cancerous tumor removed, I always had really bad dental problems, my whole life. Lot of laryngitis growing up, I'd always lose my voice. I was diagnosed as hypothyroid as you can tell super talkative, you know. So I have all these signs and symptoms of a throat chakra that was out of balance. When I looked deeper, I realized that that this is what happens when you are unable to speak truth. And I realized I didn't realize but I'd put two and two together that as a kid, oldest child, alcoholic father, super religious mother, I was never allowed to speak truth about what was happening at my home. It was my job to go out into the world and to church into school and just project a smile on my face like life is it's all good. It's all good. And that was just the biggest lie. And so just below the surface was all the all the truth and the darkness, but my it got stuck in my throat. And I believe that all of those conditions showed up because of that block. And that, that that lack of flow of energy. And so when I realized that I started doing the work to balance my throat chakra and you know, that was, I don't know 15 Or maybe even 2015 years ago, let's say and I'm just so grateful for this work because I I've found be my own healer. I could have gone to a lot of doctors and asked why I have dental problems and a thyroid and that Western doctors would never connect those two things. So did I answer your question,
Katie Kay
you fact I threw you a big question that Thank you for giving us a little background and then also sharing your personal story. I also have a connection to the throat chakra. And I always like I always think that throat and I know I'm saying, chakra, how do you say it Denise chakra chakra, like chalk. Okay, chakra. And, and, and I maybe think that some of these are also common and just from society standards of yeah, not being really able to speak up for yourself and your own needs. And I also feel like that can be really tied into people pleasing tendencies and afraid of conflict, which I'm also working on. Because I think that a lot of my life, I chose to go the easier route, rather than show up for myself in times that I needed to, and speak my truth. And maybe it was would be uncomfortable for somebody else. But yeah, I was I was willing to kind of abandon myself for that. And so I also feel like I have done some chakra meditations. And we did that in that yoga teacher training. And it was just kind of like a black blob around my throat. But I always find it really, I guess, lately, doing just some, like spirituality work and trying to understand maybe some of my deeper wounds. I find it fascinating that I, my story, my background, I think I just had such a beautiful growing up and childhood and. And there's nothing that I can really pinpoint that would maybe say that or explain, I guess, logically why I would feel so much trauma inside. And I was like, I kind of wonder why that is. And I kind of think that maybe I can be a voice for some of the people that also feel the same way that maybe there's not an explanation to their inner turmoil or trauma. Logically, they can't really think of anything, they feel very, again, that word like privileged and fortunate and really grateful. But it doesn't have a direct reflection into how we feel on the inside. And so I guess that it's powerful in the way that there can still exist a lot of deep pain, even if there's no cognitive reason for it. And it allowed myself I almost gave myself permission to look into some of those deeper fears. And, and just what I talked about feeling unsupported and myself feeling helpless, and not being able to show up for myself and, and I think sometimes honestly, that's just cues that we get from society and lessons that are just kind of ingrained into our, into our thoughts. And then they become our patterns. And then obviously they come our core belief system. And so I know that there's other people out there that that experience some of that internal trauma, and I just want it to be maybe heard and I want people to feel supported and and sometimes the chakra work can really show show us some of that, that deeper stuff. So
Denise Druce
absolutely. Absolutely. Let me just kind of go on to super short tangents about this because I wholeheartedly agree with everything you say. And very often there's not a story there. We can store things as simple as you know what a kid said on the playground or, you know, depending on your birth order, like how were you influenced by siblings or relatives. There might not have been any, quote, massive big trauma that you can remember. But we do like you said through media, through school through say things teachers said at formative ages. We just don't know what we heard and believed and then stored as truth in our bodies. So I think there's that I also would throw out I would be an irresponsible Yogi if I didn't acknowledge that, you know, maybe some of that is there from past lives. You know, that maybe some of that is part of this lesson that our soul is here to learn and it's carried from somewhere else. You know, there's that. And then this is so fascinating to me the work we're doing with trauma sensitivity. So I'm a yoga therapist now. And so I've done a lot of studying in terms of exactly what we're talking about. And so think about this, when you were wealthy think about this. Think about this. When a female is in her mother's womb, that baby already has all of its eggs, in its ovaries, 2 million eggs are already in a baby's body. Okay, so just think about this for a minute, you were in your mother. And when your mother was in her mother, you existed as one of those 2 million eggs inside of your mother's ovaries. So the possibility of you like 50% of Katie, existed and lived for almost 10 months inside of your maternal grandmother's womb? So did you get some of her DNA? Absolutely. And what gets passed on through DNA trauma, like so I think it's worth all of us looking at like, who was our maternal grandmother? And what was her experience when she was pregnant? What was she living through, and someone my age, that person was living through, like, the Depression and World War, and there was all kinds of trauma and fear and scarcity that had to be passed on to the possibility of me, right? And then, you know, along comes mom, and your mom's carrying you in her belly, and you're getting all of whatever your mom was going through at the time. Right? So there doesn't have to be a story that happened in the 20. Whatever years, you've been on this, you know, alive, it could have come along before
32. I just had, like, I feel so good right now. 20.
Denise Druce
So that's kind of like, mind blowing to think about the possibility of where all what we're made of,
Katie Kay
yeah, oh, my gosh, I love that. Because it's like, what I always love to say in a podcast is one shift in perspective, can open up all this space and completely change. You know, it can change everything, I can change your relationship to self and how you see yourself. And in that tiny perspective, it's really Oh, it's crazy to think about the inner generational trauma, or you know, all the things that we can carry into this life and what you're talking about with like the karma, I would love to think of it as like a backpack of karma, and you carry it into this life, and you're just trying to burn like, you reach back there, and then you're faced with a struggle, and then you're just trying to burn it off and move through it. And that's also I just love that perspective. And yeah, so I think, like, just in like an envelope thing, this whole conversation is, there's so much out of our own perspective, and even our thinking mind that exists out there, and we might not even be able to see it or understand it. And the yoga therapy that you're talking about is, I think just so amazing in the way that our somatic experience in our body, our body can tell us so much and like the Body Keeps the Score, the Body Keeps the Score, Body Keeps the Score, and there's so much to learn. And, and I think that was a big thing for me is changing my relationship to my body is I had a lot of stuckness. Like I had a lot of things that I had to work through. And they were they were internal in the way that it was Yeah, trauma, fears, wounds. And once I could kind of do that work in therapy, that, that that some of that got released, and it just got a little bit easier and easier to to connect to my body in the way that I that I really wanted to. But man, we could, I would talk about this. I'm just getting into the whole yoga therapy, but I won't dive too hard into it.
Denise Druce
Another episode on yoga therapy, because there's so much there. And I think we can leave it in this light. And this wraps back to your very first yoga class and yoga therapy is very clear on this. It's not my job as a yoga teacher, yoga therapist to make you feel better. It's my job to help you feel. And that's exactly what like to wrap that back to the beginning. That's exactly what happened for you as you stepped into a space where it was finally safe for you to feel what was there to be felt. And that's not always easy. In fact, it's rarely easy. It's at some but it's really important.
Katie Kay
Really important. Thank you. Thank you for full circling that the true yogi. Perfect. Can we dive a little bit into Denise just like your kind of daily wellness practices, I love to ask that guests this, towards the end of the episode just to give us all a little inspiration and understand what you do to take care of your body every day can give us a little reflection into maybe some inspiration for our own our own wellness plan.
Denise Druce
Okay, so here's the part where if, in the event that my husband listens to this, I have to be super honest.
Okay, that's perfect. I love honesty,
Denise Druce
being transparent with you. Because what I would love to say is, I wake up early every morning, and I meditate and I move my body and I eat perfectly clean food. And that is just not the truth, thank God. But what I do think is really important is that like, for me, I have to start the day in a good mindset. So I have a super simple routine where I just get up and sit on the edge of my bed and just stretch right there. I just put my arms in the air and I just yawn and make a few sigh You know, sighs and then just take a few breaths. And I set an intention at the beginning of my day. And it's usually a word or I have a little, like a little daily meditation or affirmation book by the bed. If I can start that way. Like, I think it was three days ago, the word that I opened up to was radical acceptance. And I didn't read anything beyond just the title of that. And I just said, Okay, today, it's a whole day of radical acceptance. And it's amazing how just having one or two words as an overlay changes the way I show up for every single thing. So I start like that. I usually go you know, I do my morning routine. And I've started to do a lot of the IR VEDA practices, which I swear is I'm going to knock on wood, I know it's gonna be noisy. Why I haven't gotten COVID To my knowledge yet because I wake up in the first thing I do is the tongue scraping and the oil pulling and the like the nasiha oil and my nostrils. I am like a religious fanatic about that now and I just do that quick hygiene routine first thing in the morning. And then I would just say as far as the rest of the day goes, I'm absolutely committed to moving my body every day. And I have been for 40 years and I think that's for me, that's my, that's my health care. That's my self care. That's my time for me and so some days that's yoga some days it's a walk with the dog, some days it's a hike some days it's a cycle class, but I try to get in six days a week I don't try to I get in six days a week an hour and that's to me that is bread and butter and I'm not good at nutrition I am not good at nutrition I try to drink a lot of water and I don't eat a lot of food that's really bad for you but I could really up fruit and vegetable intake so that's the honest truth but I've always just managed kind of my health and energy and weight and everything else by just moving my body every day.
Katie Kay
Thank you for sharing and I'm so happy that you're not perfect so far from it in my eyes you you will you are but but thank God that your wellness isn't perfect because I think there's there there's no perfect place and and I love the simplicity of some of your exercises and I think we all can add a little bit more simplicity and just the gratitude of being able to stretch in the morning and I love how you're getting into your VEDA me to like just started learning about it and taking the aggravated training and I love that practice because it is so unique to the individual and that is encouraging because this whole one size fits all is obviously not working for all of us and and yeah so while definitely we may need to hit on that Aveda when we have our next interview and Jen Solomon she's a Ayurvedic health counselor and I know that's years and years and years of training so I'll have to have her on on the podcast as well. So we create we can no more you can just soak in all the all the information and yeah because
Denise Druce
there's so many things that we don't practice here in the West that are just easy just simple wellness tools that make big a big difference, huh?
Katie Kay
Yeah 100% And, and oh, I was gonna say that I or VEDA if you're feeling a little off with your eating routine and your nutrition I've been incorporating Some of the Ayurvedic like the Khichuri in the morning, and so some of that has been really supportive for me. So maybe that's, that's
Denise Druce
moving. I had to trade my coffee habit in the morning for like, some healthy food because I can live on coffee till 2pm. So that's my next. That's my 2023 plan. I love it. I love it.
Katie Kay
We all have to have a plan some goals. Great, Denise, thank you so much. I mean, I set it at the beginning. Just being able to sit down with you today. It's yeah, it's kind of worthless. And I just think that it's, it's, I'm just so grateful. I guess it's a word. I'm, I'm just so so grateful. And I, and I think I can just speak for a lot of a lot. And hopefully I can speak for a lot of people. In just my words of how profound your energy is, and I'm, and I just I hope that I did it justice. But we'll have to do another one, because there's our other so much more. But yeah, thank you so much for being here and sharing your love and energy. And are there any last messages that you would love to share with our audience? And if not, no big deal. And oh, I'm apologize. Also, I would love for you to tell about any kind of upcoming trainings, or retreats and when you teach yoga, and obviously, I'll put all that information in the show notes, so people can check it out as well.
Denise Druce
Awesome. Awesome. It's just, it's an honor to be here. It really is. And thank you for all of your kind words. And I'm just I'm really proud of you. I feel kind of like a little mama bear right now. But it's just, it's such a joy for me to see one of my students just, I know, it took a lot of courage and vulnerability for you to start this podcast. And just to see you standing in your own footprints just powerfully, and maybe with shaky legs, sometimes your heart is open, you are just you found your voice. I think this process is really helping, like heal anything in the throat chakra too. And it's fun to see that I know you're making a difference in the world, I know that these conversations are so helpful and so important for so many people right now. And so that's the those would be my parting words, that you know, to the listeners to do what Katie's doing, which is just stand in your own footprints, take a deep breath and look around because you're you're you're right where you're supposed to be. And, you know, what's here now is probably what you're supposed to be doing. As far as things going on, we have ongoing teacher trainings three times a year. And, and, and a 300 hour training for anyone that's already done there. 200, all of our trainings now are hybrid, which means you can choose in person or virtual, and we train both groups at the same time. So we really had fun next, you know, working on that technology. So that's all at yoga assets.com. And I do have a yoga retreat in April on Maui. And I have a few spots. So if anybody wants to just get out of the inversion and the cold, and come to a beautiful island with me and do a lot of yoga and meditation, and some hiking to waterfalls. Hit me up.
Katie Kay
Oh my gosh. And you do you do those retreats every year?
Denise Druce
We do every year this year, we're doing two because I feel like we all got ripped off with COVID We didn't get to do I missed a year. So I'm putting an extra one in this year. So April and then again in November.
Katie Kay
Oh, perfect. Okay, I texted all my girlfriends. I told them as interviewing you today, and they were all like, find out if Denise is doing one next year and we'll all sign up. And so we'll be there and 2023 baby.
Denise Druce
Okay. All right. I'll put your names down. All right. Well, thank
Katie Kay
you again, Denise. And thank you all the listeners. I know that your time is precious. So showing up here showing up for yourself. I just commend you for your courage. And thank you so much for being here. Love you all on my mind. I'll see you all next week.
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